The question for Monday: Why do you need your clear asap?

[odie]

I'm pretty patient but it can be difficult to want to stay behind on a mechanic you have mastered. I remember trying to get a clear on Turn 5 but my static completely sucked at showing up when they were supposed to. I jumped in with different groups attempting to get it down. Wipe after wipe, people drop and get swapped out with someone else. When you're still a learning party, learners obviously join. But it really just sucks when you just got everyone in that group managing the fireballs and conflags, so close to getting everyone through divebombs, just to have 2 or 3 new people that you have to teach fireballs and conflags too all over again. With a mechanic as simple as that one, it really does get frustrating when it takes another hour or two for them to get it down, at which point someone else drops and needs replaced by...you guessed it....another person that has to learn the previous mechanic.

I also find that the longer you take to get content cleared, the worse the players get that you end up getting put with later. By starting content right away and putting focus into clearing it quickly, I get more serious party members, and most of those runs go pretty smoothly. After you have enough experience with it you can join farm parties, and personally to me, it makes it much easier to enjoy that content. Wait too long though, and you'll be certain to wipe more, clears take longer, and it is harder to find groups to help you get the farm momentum you would have had if you'd started earlier.

[Stormfur]

I really wish we had an option like Sea, Stone, Sky but for various phases of raid/EX mechanics. So that we can practice on our own. It would be the same arena as the main fight, the "team" could be made up of NPCs that would get KO'ed but not killed (scions perhaps?) and this way you can see how the boss moves, how to dodge different things and basically just learn the mechanics at your own pace. I know that defeats the purpose of the MM part of MMORPGs but if you want players to "git gud" but also don't want them making you lag behind, give them a way to practice that doesn't involve sparring dummies.

[odie]

I really wish we had an option like Sea, Stone, Sky but for various phases of raid/EX mechanics. So that we can practice on our own. It would be the same arena as the main fight, the "team" could be made up of NPCs that would get KO'ed but not killed (scions perhaps?) and this way you can see how the boss moves, how to dodge different things and basically just learn the mechanics at your own pace. I know that defeats the purpose of the MM part of MMORPGs but if you want players to "git gud" but also don't want them making you lag behind, give them a way to practice that doesn't involve sparring dummies.

I don't like the dummies either. I imagined putting the player in a duty that let them go through the phases slowly until they mastered it. So keep dodging aoes, or placing markers in certain places until they get the hang of it and move them to the next phase.

[Mercutial]

Because all of us at one point or another have dragged our feet in clearing the latest primal. The results are never good- the quality of teammates dips further and further the longer you wait. That's why many of us rush to get on board the first or second week farm train.

[Nabiri]

When I can't find a learning party that suits my needs or that lasts more than a few deaths, I make my own.

If I make my own learning group I can ensure I get in some practice for as many hours as I like. Any impatient people leave, weeding themselves out until I'm left with a group who WANTS to learn and practice. I just keep setting up party finder till we have a solid group.

Anyone who complains about others' lack of skill is free to leave and join another group.
The only people who get kicked from my group are those who pick on others. Everyone else is free to stay and learn, regardless of skill level.

[Khalithar]

This here. If you don't hop on content quickly in this game, you're getting left behind. Am I okay with this? No. But that's how it works.

This, for better or worse.

[LineageRazor]

Do you really think we're all too stupid as to have not figured this out (and for at least some of us, attempted this) on our own?

Stupid, no. Unconfident, yes.

Time and again, I hear of folks bitterly complaining that there's never a party to join. When I ask why they don't make one themselves, they respond as though such a suggestion is outrageous. "I don't know how to lead a party," or other such nonsense - like you need any kind of leadership skills to put together an early-phase pug in PF!

Hopefully this thread will let folks know that it's okay to form your own parties. You don't need to be a leader to get a group going in Party Finder!

Seriously, you think those like me didnt try ? we did try...we simply dont bother anymore or just wait for it to be in DF..eventually.

Yes, I seriously thought you didn't try. Kudos for you if you did. But there are PLENTY who feel like they need some kind of degree in business management before they can crack open Party Finder and select "Recruit Members". Since you didn't mention anything about making your own, I assumed you were one such person.

You shouldn't give up, though, if you're really interested in completing this content. "Just waiting for it to be in DF" is a pretty sure recipe for failure!

[Andevom]

From what I've been told, this is exclusive to the NA/EU servers. JP servers allegedly have far more learning parties available and accept that not everyone is going to be a pro even months into the content.

Considering they added a Raid Finder to queue for Midas learning groups, I really think they should add this feature for EX Trials. Honestly, the only reason I can see for not throwing these in the Duty Finder from the getgo is to bring people in the server together. But it's clear it's not doing that well, so the whole requirement of a pre-formed party should be dropped.

[Souljacker]

like you need any kind of leadership skills to put together an early-phase pug in PF!

This is not entirely accurate. The party leader is still expected to direct the team, so you *do* need leadership skills and a general knowledge of the fight, especially three weeks to a month out from the latest primal. There's an expectation that you've "watched a youtube video" and can lead the team.


This is why I wish the hard mode content wasn't *so* far removed from the extreme mode content or we had some other way to get into practice modes of extreme mode content. I feel like I mastered the hard mode in a couple tries, enough that I finished both Seph and Nid on my feet in random groups by try #2, but extreme content is so much more difficult with no way to practice other than hoping the 7 other people don't bail after the first wipe. The gap is huge and doesn't have to be. The hard mode content could stand to be a little harder.

If you're a little behind, like I am, forget about it. I have to now wait until this content is obsolete to finish it.

[Ryel]

This is not entirely accurate. The party leader is still expected to direct the team, so you *do* need leadership skills and a general knowledge of the fight, especially three weeks to a month out from the latest primal. There's an expectation that you've "watched a youtube video" and can lead the team.

Except that this is only true if you do not specify otherwise in the PF description.

There have been times where myself or friends have been behind on content and wanted to set up a learning party in the party finder, so we would specifically describe the party as a "wiping party" and make sure to get the point across that we were going in to get our feet wet and had very little to no knowledge of the fight.

More often than not the party either filled with like minded individuals who wanted to test the waters and get some experience or others who have cleared before but wanted practice on a new job or role (like tanking / healing), occasionally we would even have players join who simply wanted to help others learn the fight because they had free time on their hands.

There were the few times that there were players who joined the party without fully understanding the intent and would get impatient and leave but those cases were few and far between.

The key is that you have to be up front about exactly what you're trying to do and in some cases wait for other like-minded individuals to fill the spots, but for many players it does start by stepping out of your comfort zone and actually putting up a party.

The reason the JP servers have more learning parties in the PF is because they are being made by both players who want to teach and players who want to learn.

This idea of sitting around and waiting for the perfect learning party to show up and then complaining that there aren't any players making them however will accomplish far less than tossing one up and taking a few lumps here and there and more importantly not giving up after a few bad experiences.