Early Pulling - Is it wrong?

[Alistaire]

Oh god...just realised...SE won't even act on reports of early pullers because they aren't violating ToS. You're worries hold no weight and will have zero impact on the right click report function. The GMs who review the reports are why we can have nice things.

Edit: To avoid making another post...I'm extremely thankful for the people on Mateus who are courteous and do wait for everyone to arrive before pulling. There are a few occasions here and there where there will be people who pull extremely fast and do not allow time for everyone to gather, but in my experience, and I hunt A LOT, at least 98% of the time people are very patient and respectful of everyone on Mateus.

You misunderstand, I'm not saying reporting "early pullers" will work, I'm saying SE will get flooded by idiots reporting "early pullers" with that feature so much they'll end up removing the feature. The new feature is the "nice thing" and people abusing it to report someone pulling a hunt mob is what will make it so we can't have that nice thing.

tl;dr we're on the same page.

The act of interfering with other's enjoyment of the game IS against the rules.

Directly from the EULA:
"Disruption. You may not in any way disrupt or interfere with the Game experience of other players"

So if someone has an ugly or too sexy glamour I can say they're interfering with my enjoyment of the game? If someone undercuts me that's interference too! ...this is just getting silly.

[FinaSel]

So if someone has an ugly or too sexy glamour I can say they're interfering with my enjoyment of the game? If someone undercuts me that's interference too! ...this is just getting silly.

But would you really say that because someone's glamour is too ugly or sexy that it is preventing you from enjoying the game? Really? Would you really say that?
Which is more ridiculous? Wearing "ugly" or "sexy" glamour or complaining that someone's glamour is too ugly or sexy?

And please consider whether the other person is deliberately wearing that glamour just to make you angry and because they get a kick out of making others mad.

Undercutting someone and pulling an S rank before the group that worked hard to spawn it arrives on purpose are two totally different things too.
Keep in mind: is the person undercutting you doing it just to make you angry because that is fun for them? Or are they doing it because they are also trying to sell something...without any evil intention of ruining your experience.

People seem to be either missing or avoiding the main point here. If someone is purposefully interfering with others' ability to enjoy the game for their own selfish reasons, knowing what they are doing is causing many other people trouble, yet, despite knowing that continue to do it simply for the fun of being an annoying brat...then yeah I think would definitely violate the EULA of "Disruption".

[Alistaire]

But would you really say that...

No, I wouldn't. I was clearly pointing out the ridiculousness of pointing out that rule when players are playing within the rules.

[Gallus]

Kinda like how the world is progressively becoming a more socialist place...but more often than not this also leads to people arguing against the obvious. Yes the concept of early pulling is often translated as "don't pull until I get there", but this guy in my server pulls with the sole purpose of screwing up hundreds of people, I've seen him pull multiple times while not in party (queueing up for a dungeon for instance), and hunt was zerged in barely 10-15 seconds so he's not even getting credit sometimes, he just does it because "he can" and "it's fun".
Do you know what's the problem about having a mindset that more or less supports what this guy is doing? (not a violation of the TOS and shouldn't be or it's his money let him play the way he wants or I could also wear glamour and cause distress among people and that wouldn't be reportable either -lol-), it leads to situations such as the one we have with housing now. "Where's my right to own 12 houses with 12 different alts?", "Where's my right to play the game like I want even if that involves repeteadly ruining hundreds (thousands in fact) of tomes and seals of hundreds of players?". At the end of the day, you are screaming out to be ruled, and if they don't do anything about it, it's not because it's cool, correct or ethic, it probably has something more to do with the whole thing not being worth from a business standpoint.

[MeiUshu]

snip.

But it is ruled, that is what you dont understand, it is ruled that is not against any rules to pull whenever you are in front of a hunt, simple. Do I agree with that mentality ? no,but is only a question of moral responsability and as you know morality varies from people to people.

You want it the way you want it because that is what YOU deem it should be like so in essence you are trying to impose to the rest your vision of what this hunt should be like...he is there nothing forbids him to do so, nothing forces him to join any groups (for your information I often do hunts alone because groups dont bother should I not hunt if I am not in a group? because in essence is what you said) to do the hunt, nothing forces him to wait, no rules nothing, YOU want a ruling because YOU are annoyed, where as he is not..and I am pretty sure that if you did the same and he was late he would not complain now if you choose not to do the same that is YOUR decision but you cant blame someone else to do somethign that is ALLOWED, you know the word ALLOWED. I agree morally there is a kind of sort of modicum that should be respected but nobody is FORCED to abide by a rule that is written nowhere..eh?

You speak of socialism but screaming like you do calls for rulling, not him, YOU call for it, YOU call for a rulling and you are going to scream on any rulling about hunts when and if they happen and going to blame all the rest BUT yourself about said rulling when in truth you would be one of the major reasons why it was put in place in the first place.

Again, I am not in agreement but you cant blame someone to do something that is allowed to do..Tough on those that are not there. Nothing forbids those to use spreadsheets/linshells/ friends/huntsyou name it themselves to find that hunt why should you rely on chat to join a hunt ? I am also against the mentality of...*anyway I will wait for others to find the hunt and I dont have to do it myself* and those that abid by that rule shoudl all be chatized because is pure lazyness in my opinion. Is that fun to do what he does ? to me is not but to him is..who are you to tell to someone that he cant have his fun..his fun is NOT in pulling (people acting like him is not the action that is the fun but the consequence) his fun is seeing the rage that follows his pulling, if you stopped raging and just played along without saying a word instead of fueling him and giving him a reason to continue doing what you complain he is doing, he would stop after a while why ? because is no fun anymore...ever thought of that ?

I will say it again I dont agree with what he does but he has the right to do it. So either play along, do the same, or just find something else.. There will always be jerks, there will always be silly people, but as long as they play by the rules in place, there is no reasons for you to complain just because YOU didnt get your fill of seals and what not.

Just my opinion, of course (and yeah I am strange)

[Gallus]

but you cant blame someone to do something that is allowed to do..

Being allowed to do something doesn't always mean it's not miserable.

his fun is seeing the rage that follows his pulling, if you stopped raging and just played along without saying a word instead of fueling him and giving him a reason to continue doing what you complain he is doing, he would stop after a while why ? because is no fun anymore...ever thought of that ?

Because how half server reacts is totally on my hands. It's far more reasonable to ask hundreds of people that may be different in every hunt perfect coordination and a cold mind not to press a single skill out of their hotbars rather than telling a single individual not to trigger the masses. We can't even expect one individual behave let's better try doing so with thousands of players.

or just find something else..

I did, I'm not after hunts anymore.

There will always be jerks, there will always be silly people, but as long as they play by the rules in place, there is no reasons for you to complain just because YOU didnt get your fill of seals and what not.

Not the reason, at all. Gonna say it again this isn't about my seals or my tomes, it's about for instance spending 20 minutes trying to catch a fish so that as many people can benefit from an S and seeing the entire thing become a drama with the same ***** as the main character over and over again.

there is no reasons for you to complain

You are writing an entire wall of text to justify the actions of someone who is acting like a complete douche yet I have no reason or right to even say I find his attitude detrimental.

[MeiUshu]

snip.

you can argue as much as you want...is still allowed and whether you find it stupid, dumb, detrimental and stuff alike is STILL allowed. YOu have to accept that fact...The only thing you can do is complain to SE because THEY set the rules and tell them how silly it is and better yet, because all I have heard you say is complain, offer a solution I have yet to see something like that from you.

Yes you are right, I am defending his right to do what he is allowed to do. I dont agree with it but he has the right to do it and shaming him for doing what he is allowed to do is WRONG very wrong and diffamatory in some ways.

You are complaining of a rule that doesnt suit you..should all the rules be adapted to your wish ? because that is what you are saying. You want stuff to be made in such way that they comply with your vision ..but you are not alone as you could read in this thread many dont find anything wrong in his attitude but I personally find a lot wrong with yours trying to shame someone for I will repeat it again DOING SOMETHING THAT HE IS ALLOWED TO DO.

Try to think a bit and come up with complains that are factually some and not some childish stuff over some even more childish stuff coming from childish people.

@ElHeggunte

What he does is not griffing...he is attacking an hunt without waiting people.. ohh mean the emotes ? you shoudl forbid those too? right ?

[ElHeggunte]

snip

Griefing is against the rules. Pulling early specifically because you know it'll piss off and screw over other player is griefing. The player Gallus described is breaking the rules with his early pulling.