Variance in player skill is hurting FFXIV's itemization design.

[Ibi]

Diadem was fine, but the crybabies of casuals came to the internet complain about it because it would require effort to get decent gear, it was a grind fest, yes, but the only real grind there was, good job casuals, keep killing content, at this rate in one year there will be 10% of hardcores and raiders than there is now.

Are there really people that honestly enjoy content with minimal engagement, requiring zero skill and near-zero effort with extremely low reward rates?

I found diadem mind-numbingly boring, personally. The only good thing about it was that spending more than fifteen minutes in there actually made me eager to get back into A3S/A4S.

[Venur]

I get your point, raid alone is fun but the reward is not that great. It really isn't. So if raid gear does get better (not only ilvl up) but also form for bonus stats would be cool to have. It's not like it's a game breaker for casuals either no? Why would you need great gear for only doing dungeons?

Why raider would need to have funier items then none raider ? Dungeon ilvl is lower because you don't need bether stats gear if your not raiding.

But it doesn't make sense to claim that raider need cooler stuff because they raid. They just need bether stats to achieve a harder goal.

[Granyala]

I think giving casuals alternate methods of acquisition other than just "wait for the raid nerf" is what's more important, tbh. I don't raid not because I'm not "good enough", I don't raid cuz it's boring. Pre-scripted encounters with lockstep synchro swimming mechanics and a "someone died, time to wipe" fail ratio aren't interesting to me. I actually find myself as a healer most challenged in Mhach these days, where my ability to adapt and react to scenarios has salvaged many a run. So for me, the ideal ways to get gear would be from there, or from the Esos/Lore I get from running the place repeatedly.

Same here. Why I do consider raids fun (I have the skill to raid Mythic in WoW) I got tired of the scheduled play and coordination dance with 1 or 2 guys screwing it up all the time.

These days I want to play when and for how long I feel like.
I don't want to contend with dumb loot RNG and I most certainly don't want to contend with underperforming raid members.
Been an officer, done that long enough.

This is why I happen to like the tome gear (guaranteed progress at my own pace) and Mhachs difficulty level is pretty much spot on for raids featuring random people.
Not as hilariously braindead as WoWs LFR. >.<

Diadem was fine, but the crybabies of casuals came to the internet complain about it because it would require effort to get decent gear

Diadem is NOT fine. It is a skull-imploding™ boring RNG grind clusterf***.
I don't pay a sub to mindlessly farm mobs and if that is what casual content is supposed to look like, I'm out.
WAAY more entertaining games out there.

[Vivi_Bushido]

Are there really people that honestly enjoy content with minimal engagement, requiring zero skill and near-zero effort with extremely low reward rates?

I found diadem mind-numbingly boring, personally. The only good thing about it was that spending more than fifteen minutes in there actually made me eager to get back into A3S/A4S.

Some people do actually. I did. But not because I enjoyed the physical content like Diadem. I enjoyed getting the gear and how quickly I was able to progress simply by sacrificing and hour or two at a time to gear up. It wasn't the content that was fun. It was the thrill of the rewards that made it fun.

[Nalien]

Diadem was fine

As someone who desires grind heavy content, no it wasn't... Diadem was and is fairly terrible, it's a shortsighted and lazy mess... Sadly they also seem to be taking the Frontlines approach to Exploration Missions, and we'll be getting something new (and hopefully better), rather than seeing them adjust Diadem at all... A shame, it had a lot of potential as an event... SE just doesn't seem to have much interest in putting effort into events, instead we just get instanced Hunts with gathering tacked on for some reason... It's still certainly doable content if you've got a FC Airship handy, but Diadem makes Dynamis look like a masterclass in games design... At its core it just didn't have any effort put into it from the developers...

[Seraphix2407]

Why raider would need to have funier items then none raider ? Dungeon ilvl is lower because you don't need bether stats gear if your not raiding.

But it doesn't make sense to claim that raider need cooler stuff because they raid. They just need bether stats to achieve a harder goal.

Give me 3 good reasons why people who don't raid should have raid stat bonus gear? If you raid you have earned it. I could go on all night about why they shouldn't have it without giving effort, but before anyone ask me or want them to give them reasons, I'd like to have you give me 3 reasons.

[RobbieH]

Diadem is NOT fine. It is a skull-imploding™ boring RNG grind clusterf***.

Of course Diadem is boring, it's a grind, every grind tends to be boring, grind for better rewards, that was diadem, don't come with the excuses of farming brain dead mobs when every dungeon in this game can be beaten with a blindfold, are you saying expert roulette isn't brain dead content and boring? I gave up on expert roulette and i get full lore cap in one day doing hunts, at lest it's a bit dynamic, god help me if i ever go into Hullbreaker HM again, if diadem was boring i don't know how to classify that dungeon.

Anyway i guess people don't understand what investment means, because that's the purpose of grinding.

I don't pay a sub to mindlessly farm mobs and if that is what casual content is supposed to look like, I'm out.

You don't? From my point of view everything besides end-game raiding (and props to SE for Weeping City) is exactly that, but to each their own.

[Seraphix2407]

Diadem is NOT fine. It is a skull-imploding™ boring RNG grind clusterf***.
I don't pay a sub to mindlessly farm mobs and if that is what casual content is supposed to look like, I'm out.
WAAY more entertaining games out there.

I guess you unsubbed? Because it is grindy already and the reward? Outdated once you done with it, unless you do it super quick, then again that's hard grinding.

[Noxifer]

Give me 3 good reasons why people who don't raid should have raid stat bonus gear? If you raid you have earned it. I could go on all night about why they shouldn't have it without giving effort, but before anyone ask me or want them to give them reasons, I'd like to have you give me 3 reasons.

I don't think that's what he said. I think what he meant was "why should interesting bonuses be limited to raid gear". As in, if they decide to add some sort of bonuses outside of stats and sub stats, like "cure 1 potency +50" or whatever, that kind of system should be available on both raid gear and non-raid gear. Sure, have the types of bonuses be more effective on raid gear if you want, but the system of it shouldn't be locked to raid gear.

[Ibi]

Some people do actually. I did. But not because I enjoyed the physical content like Diadem. I enjoyed getting the gear and how quickly I was able to progress simply by sacrificing and hour or two at a time to gear up. It wasn't the content that was fun. It was the thrill of the rewards that made it fun.

I can see how that could change your perspective.

I was already in mostly i210 gear when Diadem hit. Our FC did a Diadem night for the first three weeks it was out, and I think in those three sessions I got a total of two offspec upgrades, so the reward factor was rather absent for me.

Regardless, you said yourself that it's not the content that you enjoyed, it was the rewards. Those could just as easily have been added to a system that was intrinsically interesting, rather than where they were the only motivation.