Do you feel xp gap should shorten for DoH?

[Ventus]

In light of materia, it seems with the recent inverted leveling curve for DoW/DoM that most materia requiring lv 1-30ish is rather obsolete and instead of having a fun and expansive system for our equipment we just get a system that forces a time sink on crafting .

For new players this is a nightmare I'm sure since just their options consist of focusing on 1 class and leveling at a decent rate or sluggishly/painfully leveling 4+ classes just to make 1 class well equipped throughout its growth.

I'm aware this topic is nothing new; however, I'm here to ask if you guys think the issue should be solved by shortening the xp gap between DoH levels.

If you have any other ideas let me know, this is a forum after all .

Thanks for reading!

*edit
Another thread going on that closely explains my thoughts on the matter is right here:

Click Me

[TheVedis]

without the timesink for crafting, everyone would be able to do everything too easily



1 big thing ive pushed for is a much steeper curve on exp required to level post 50
BUT
i do not extend this to crafting, crafting should remain on the slow rate of increase it already has to keep it from going overboard

[Ventus]

without the timesink for crafting, everyone would be able to do everything too easily



1 big thing ive pushed for is a much steeper curve on exp required to level post 50
BUT
i do not extend this to crafting, crafting should remain on the slow rate of increase it already has to keep it from going overboard

My only question to you is if you could possibly think of it from another person's perspective who is just starting the game or perhaps doesn't have as much time as you (seeing as you have numerous level 50 crafting classes) =(.

The bias can be strong, either from those like myself who barely level craft or those who do a lot like you, but one thing that seems to be an issue is the gargantuan amount of time needed just to maintain good gear with good materia.

Either one of two things will need to happen for yoshida to achieve his vision of playability and content for all:

1. he makes crafting more managable and less of a time sink so that materia can be handled with greater ease

or

2. content like dzaemel and ifrit have to be severely dumbed down in difficulty so that everyone can manage to kill them and not put 9001+ hours into the game so that only certain shells are able to access and succeed in the only content that exists =/.

[Nuru]

Don't even think about lowering the difficulty of level 50 content. It's like a sin!

About crafting though, I do not craft much myself, but it is easy to just shout for a crafter and have them to slot the gear for you. You don't necessarily have to level up your own crafts just to slot materia. You have a community to ask for help. They spent those countless hours leveling up their crafts, I'm sure they wouldn't mind putting themselves to good use.

[TheVedis]

My only question to you is if you could possibly think of it from another person's perspective who is just starting the game or perhaps doesn't have as much time as you (seeing as you have numerous level 50 crafting classes) =(.

The bias can be strong, either from those like myself who barely level craft or those who do a lot like you, but one thing that seems to be an issue is the gargantuan amount of time needed just to maintain good gear with good materia.

Either one of two things will need to happen for yoshida to achieve his vision of playability and content for all:

1. he makes crafting more managable and less of a time sink so that materia can be handled with greater ease

or

2. content like dzaemel and ifrit have to be severely dumbed down in difficulty so that everyone can manage to kill them and not put 9001+ hours into the game so that only certain shells are able to access and succeed in the only content that exists =/.

i am thinking of this from an aspect of whats needed to keep crafting something thats not too easily leveled(im sorry but if it got as easy as combat, itd be really dumb)

we used to get 300 exp MAX from crafting you know, now we can get up to 900 per synth, before bonus's are applied
how is this not a hard thing to do? crafters can easily get 30-50k an hour, and getting less means they are doing lower level stuff

its not slow, its really just tedious work because its not as exciting as combat

[Ventus]

30-50k an hour, and getting less means they are doing lower level stuff

its not slow, its really just tedious work because its not as exciting as combat

There's your problem =/. 30-50k isn't a universal truth for crafting growth either, perhaps for you, but considering that most people can't stand to even craft for hours in a row I doubt that speed will draw anyone closer =(.

Right now crafting is more of an obstacle than anything close to fun. Pressing standard synth gets tedious and the only fun synths come from when something like aeolian scimitars/silver tricornes/etc (aka the synths that really count) are made.

You have a community to ask for help. They spent those countless hours leveling up their crafts, I'm sure they wouldn't mind putting themselves to good use.

I see what you mean and I agree but ironically the highlighted sentence seems to only prove the point. Additionally, the community is scarce and having to simply rely on others all the time is cumbersome and something short of being on hand quickly when you need it.

Being able to manage your own crafts with ease is (but not too much ease) is preferable =)

[TheVedis]

There's your problem =/. 30-50k isn't a universal truth for crafting growth either, perhaps for you, but considering that most people can't stand to even craft for hours in a row I doubt that speed will draw anyone closer =(.

Right now crafting is more of an obstacle than anything close to fun. Pressing standard synth gets tedious and the only fun synths come from when something like aeolian scimitars/silver tricornes/etc (aka the synths that really count) are made.



I see what you mean and I agree but ironically the highlighted sentence seems to only prove the point. Additionally, the community is scarce and having to simply rely on others all the time is cumbersome and something short of being on hand quickly when you need it.

Being able to manage your own crafts with ease is (but not too much ease) is preferable =)

lets be honest

not everyone will be able to do everything(because of their personal playerstyles)

some people just arent cut out to craft in the current system, and thats fine

we really dont need to dumb it down to make it easier for everyone to get to capped crafts, the game isnt built around everyone being able to do that

just like some people will only want 1 combat class at 50, and will never craft, the same applies to how crafting is done in general

some people just wont do it, and making it easier to level wont change them not doing it, all it does is make those who want to reach 50, do it even quicker, which they dont really need to do


also, that 30-50k exp curve, is pretty universal, at the lowest end of each "grind range" for items you should be getting around 30k or so exp an hour
at the higher end youll be getting closer to 50k

factors such as having BAD GEAR, can hurt this(you people know who im talking about) as well as being stubborn and doing the easiest possible lower synths that just dont give enough exp to keep up to these standards

now add in leves...omg add in leves...

do you have any idea how much leves speed up craft leveling? ALOT let me tell you that
1 days of leves, depending on your range, is up to a FULL LEVEL of exp just from the bonus, thats not counting exp from the synths themselves



my final point, we dont need more faster leveling, when i was still leveling, i almost got annoyed when they made it faster, and faster, and faster to the point where i finished out my final jobs like they were a joke. granted i was happy to get there, but when you kill the journey, you kinda kill half the fun

[Ventus]

lets be honest

not everyone will be able to do everything(because of their personal playerstyles)

some people just arent cut out to craft in the current system, and thats fine

we really dont need to dumb it down to make it easier for everyone to get to capped crafts, the game isnt built around everyone being able to do that

just like some people will only want 1 combat class at 50, and will never craft, the same applies to how crafting is done in general

some people just wont do it, and making it easier to level wont change them not doing it, all it does is make those who want to reach 50, do it even quicker, which they dont really need to do


also, that 30-50k exp curve, is pretty universal, at the lowest end of each "grind range" for items you should be getting around 30k or so exp an hour
at the higher end youll be getting closer to 50k

factors such as having BAD GEAR, can hurt this(you people know who im talking about) as well as being stubborn and doing the easiest possible lower synths that just dont give enough exp to keep up to these standards

now add in leves...omg add in leves...

do you have any idea how much leves speed up craft leveling? ALOT let me tell you that
1 days of leves, depending on your range, is up to a FULL LEVEL of exp just from the bonus, thats not counting exp from the synths themselves



my final point, we dont need more faster leveling, when i was still leveling, i almost got annoyed when they made it faster, and faster, and faster to the point where i finished out my final jobs like they were a joke. granted i was happy to get there, but when you kill the journey, you kinda kill half the fun

Your logic seems a bit backwards O.o. You claim that the system doesn't need to be dumbed down but "dumbing down" has no correlation to crafting xp length (even if you do claim it to be too fast). Length of xp gain rate isn't = to complexity, usefulness, and immersion nor does it change the game in any profound way.

Slowing down the xp gain rate or keeping it as is does NOTHING beneficial for the game since all it accomplishes is allowing a small group of people who have the time to play this game a lot to reach high levels in a generally tedious system.

Of course leves speed things up but they are finite and will just as well drain the leves that could be otherwise spent on other classes, thus further proving that the concept of not wasting much time or having ease of leveling multiple classes to maintain decent gear fly right out the window.

you say "some people aren't cut out for crafting", but you got to consider the reason a TON of people don't craft is because, metaphorically, crafting is the big, ugly, and dreadful elephant in the room most players don't want to address as it holds no direct incentive to participate in. The only way I would feel compelled to craft is if my gear wouldn't be replaced every other second. Then and only then would it seem reasonable to spend time trying to slot in materia.

Let me just say this:
I don't root for shorter xp lengths in crafting because I want to have levels handed to me on a silver platter, rather I'd like to see the ability to place any useful material become more accesible to the player.

On the other hand I would have much fewer issues with a system that didn't have DoM/DoW insanely outlevel any reasonable rate of crafting progression.

[TheVedis]

Let me just say this:
I don't root for shorter xp lengths in crafting because I want to have levels handed to me on a silver platter, rather I'd like to see the ability to place any useful material become more accesible to the player.

On the other hand I would have much fewer issues with a system that didn't have DoM/DoW insanely outlevel any reasonable rate of crafting progression.

the new leveling system did kind of make keeping crafts up to speed a pain to do, i will admit that, but im sure thatl be fixed
however, that doesnt mean we need to speed up crafting to keep up with combat now either

the ability to make gear for people, especialy at the higher ranges should remain reserved for those willing to put in all the time it takes to get there

and again, being able to slot stuff is VERY VERY easy to do right now even without a craft, there are so many crafters out there who have taken the time to level already they will happily do it for tips if not free!


now on the other hand, for those who want to do everything themselves, this is a path they have chosen and have to live with the difficulty(much as i had to do, i spent a whole lot of time doing what i did to get everything to 50 and its a choice i made, i coulda taken the easy way out and let other people craft for me after all)

[Sephrick]

I think the way to go is to change materia so that any DoH can meld onto any piece of gear along with a change in the means of gaining exp. It doesn't have to be any faster, just less boring.

The any class can meld any materia thing is to alleviate the need for multiple crafts to handle melding (unless they do a repair-style melding mechenic prior to 2.0).