Thread: [SPOILERS] Revelations from Patch 3.3

Apparently it was all over a few days/a week at most. Which is in line with it still being 5 years after Bahamut went and raged across the land.

Personally I just discard that and go with a few months atleast, but thats me >>

Originally Posted by Theodric

<Rambling ahead>

Are the Ascians even aware of Ilberd? I mean, they probably are but they've never mentioned him directly and as far as we know Teledji and Ilberd weren't acting due to Ascian manipulation - they did so due to greed, selfishness and misguided pride. If 4.0 is going to be light on Ascian activity then either we deal them a major blow before that point or the premise of 4.0 is based around them succeeding and we clean up after them. I'm hoping for the latter scenario, personally, since it'll feel rather cheap if Elidbus dies without succeeding after such a long build up.

It'll probably be us beating up Edgelander and co pretty badly, leading to Elidibus and the other Ascians stepping back to take stock of the situation and prepare for a way to deal with us decisively. Also doubt Elidibus would die this soon, he'd probably be either the last or second-to-last Ascian to die overall.

Finally taking time to look over the thread.

MSQ:

You may need to read this post a couple more times after I say this, but I actually didn't find any significant issues with the writing this time. If anything, I wanted them to be more heavy-handed about the power of hope. Oh well. For the first time in more than two years I feel like we've actually accomplished something. We'll see how long that lasts.

Talking to Matoya afterwards seems to indicate Alphinaud is looking for a way to separate Minfilia and Hydaelyn. She hasn't told him anything, but seems to indicate that there actually is something there for him to find.

City of Mhuch Wiping:

But seriously, delving into an ancient pyramid, with Cait Sith in tow, in pursuit of the Black Materia Nullstone. Was I the only one expecting an FFVII reference at the end there? Nope, little guy survived to raid another day. Speaking of, the raid itself would be perfect if not for the other 23 people.

Syrcus Tower was awesome on its own, too, though, so lets see if they can stick the landing this time.

Agent of Inquiry:

Gigi is precious. Cyr is doubly precious. Lord Edmont is somehow still involved in all this nonsense. Why was this only two quests?

Also, Julyan Manderville gets my vote for DRK 60-70 trainer.

Originally Posted by Fenral

<snip>

MSQ, and stuff.

The writing was decent. Ysayle and Haurchefant's spirits helping you out was a bit of a deus ex machina in my opinion, but it's certainly better than "suddenly use the Echo to filter Nidhogg's soul out of Estinien." All of the major plot threads that have been in the forefront since 2.3 (when Ysayle and Ishgard first started to step onto the stage) have been resolved, and after all of 2.55 and 3.x being a sad ride we finally managed to accomplish something lasting and good.

... the good mood will likely last until 3.55, I'd wager, when the impetus that leads us into Ala Mhigo gets dropped. Either that or early-mid 4.0 if they decide to show how horrible war really is.

Weeping City (I just finished it too):

Nope, wasn't expecting that. The Nullstone's exact appearance wasn't known until we beat the shit outta Calofisteri, and the pyramid wasn't visible until we got a ways into the city.

The raid is fine, people just need to get used to being unable to faceroll it. For a while, at least. I'm more disappointed the minion isn't a Wind-up Ozma (Ozmasphere?).

Originally Posted by Cilia

Weeping City (I just finished it too):7

In fairness....

Ozma seems more like Mount Material IMO

Originally Posted by Cilia

snip

On the MSQ's resolution:

I'm surprised that Moose's theory about just ripping the eyes off and walking away with Estinien intact was correct, but not disappointed. Ysayle and Haurchefant showing up made an Advent Children reference with them walking off together into the light, but I consider the whole experience symbolic more than being actual divine intervention.

On The Wiping City:

That was more my theory I was thinking about as we approached the temple proper. Like, "oh, this hasn't happened before." Had a lot of time to think about it while lying on Forgall's floorgall.

MSQ

Was entertaining, but I'm glad we're done with dragons... I don't think I could stand them much longer... I'm sick of their blatant hypocrisy and extreme racism, Tiamat is perhaps the only one I like but she's condemned herself to plot-irrelevance, at least she doesn't lump us together with the Allag and/or act like we're somehow the arrogant ones... I like Hraesvelgr after he got the OK from daddy and essentially switched sides faster than you can say "Potato", but I have a hard time believing that even happened... They make this massive point about how time is perceived differently for dragons, how Nidhoggs actions are OK because to them the betrayal is still fresh, but then... Hraesvelgr goes from "Piss off" to "Take my eye!" in moments... The way he goes from "I understand Nidhoggs rage but want nothing to do with this", to "This war is totally pointless!" just left a bad taste in my mouth... I liked the irony in us using the eye that sustained Nidhogg for 1,000 years to end this, but meh... His whole attempt to talk Nidhogg down just had me going "THESE ARE THINGS I'VE BEEN CALLING YOUR KIND OUT ON SINCE BEFORE 3.0!", I find the fact that he has the nerve to call Aymeric arrogant hilarious, they're essentially children throwing a 1,000 year tantrum and he claims we have an incurable arrogance... I think Estinien put is best; He had us to save him from his rage, Nidhogg had no one. You suck, Hraesvelgr! For an expansion focused on dragons, they sure were the weakest element... At least the children dragon know their place, and their "You can't even wait one hundred years?" is cute, rather than irritating...

I'm very interested to know what Midgardsormr is/has been up to... Since he randomly remembered he exists again and is stalking us, obviously he isn't busy defending anything, so... Yeah... Could have used his help a bit more, as usual he shows up and I have a thousand questions, but all the characters have none... No one even questions him appearing... Was kinda disappointed by his interaction with Hraesvelgr, did Hraesvelgr even say hello? His interaction with Tiamat was sorrowful, but with Hraesvelgr it was basically just "It's OK to kill this shade", "Oh, these mortals are right? DUNGEON TIME!", I'd really like to know more about their little family, given Midgardsormr strikes me as the worst father ever... Would have liked to see Midgardsormr show up when we finished Nidhogg off, too... His spirit just flew up and disappeared, would have been nice if Midgardsormr had something to say, but once again it seems he really didn't care about Nidhogg at all... Worst father ever... Hopefully Keeper of the Lake (Hard) can get me some answers out of him though, he has a lot to answer for IMO, at least he came off a whole lot less arrogant this patch...

My biggest worry now, is Derplander... With them being the focus now and they actually get some development as antagonists, but I wont hold my breath... Not even sure they'll become the focus, I expect we'll finally finish up finding Y&P and Ilberd (who was probably the mask guy from 3.2), with Elidibus and Derplander continuing to stand in the background being cryptic and, IMO, incredibly boring... Obviously someone will be entering the plot again and informing us that something is going on with Derplander, but I don't see what we can do with that information... Probably same thing we did with news on Minfilia; Instantly forget it and go back to Ishgard... You'd think Midgardsormr might have something to say on the subject of Warriors of Darkness, actually...

Oh, and absolutely nothing came ouf of that one 3.1 line; Where did Nidhogg go? They made a point to tell us that he and his hoard had flown to skies unknown, yet we get nothing on that... No where, no why... It's just something that happened and we're apparently meant to forget about it... That strikes me as foreshadowing... I'll regret repeating this, given the response I usually get, but I still think he went off to Garlemald... Having him inform (not create a BFF alliance with) Garlemald that Ishgard summoned a Primal confirms reports from the Gration and reignites the Garlemald/Eorzean conflict for 4.0, and it's fitting with his character IMO... When we survived his ultimate, he claims if he is doomed he'll take everyone down with him, which was an empty threat in the fight, but if he set it up so Garlemald has reason to attack Ishgard? Success, the Dragonsong War might be over, but Ishgard gets pulled into a whole new conflict. That strikes me as something Nidhogg would want to happen as a Plan B...

Complaints aside, 3.3 is best patch IMO, and I still haven't touched Regula/Mhach... Dragons being stupid is a small complain honestly, everything else about the patch has been blowing me away so far...

Those eyes are totally coming back to haunt us, I'll get my Shinryu out of them yet! I mean really, Nabriales wanted Tupsimati for a Rejoining, and Nidhoggs eye was shown to be functionally the same... Elidibus would be a fool not to retrieve them, and some how I don't think a "bottomless" abyss would phase an immortal jerk-spirit and his painfully transparent friends... They can breath on the moon FFS! Fall damage has nothing on the endless void of space...

I'm incline to think Yoshida commenting that Estinien picking up the eyes wont seem so stuipd now was a jab at us/Alphinaud/Aymeric... Yeah, Estinien picking up the eyes to take them out of reach of man and dragon seems a whole lot less stupid than tossing them into the hands of the enemy...

Originally Posted by Nalien

Snip

With regards and to the defense of dragons as a massive fan of them in the story I feel like I ought to chime in response.

In my opinion, the problem is we spent too little time with the dragons considering our interactions are limited to a bit at Anyx Trine, and a bit after that. We've got no understanding of why they feel this way, and yet the story spends so much time painting even conservative Ishgardians like the barmaid that drugged us in a sympathetic light. The story and writing with the dragons lacked quality and that's the big issue, while we got time to talk to the lower class and higher class of Ishgard, buddy buddying with Aymeric and other Elezen forever the dragons lacked that same deal. Even Hraesvelgr had feelings of tiring towards the war, even if he hates to admit it or show signs that don't seem arrogant to himself, his dialogue before Sohr Kahl seems to indicate so. Midgardsormr's words just pushed him to give out a trail, to test us as basically any other character in the story has done before, and all things considered (Dragons giving plenty of respect to their family), Hraesvelgr changing his mind a bit after his father's words is hardly bizarre. I think you'd being a bit too harsh on the dragons (Or rather the story failed to try much at all to making the dragons sympathetic when it's not hard to do so). Dragon's have a haughty way of speaking. Similar.. Look at the nobles of Ishgard or Ul'dah, beings of power mean the same way and I don't think there was any ill will to him calling Aymeric arrogant, it's just how they spoke. It also should be said that I'm not sure on the Japanese dialogue, which from what I've read concerning Midgardsormr, often writes him a whole lot less arrogant and I wouldn't be surprised if it was similar with Hraesvelgr

Midgardsormr really just seems to poke his head in when we need that final push, or perhaps passive letting us use his power whenever, considering what accorded before Heavensward even began. I mean, really what does he need to do besides give us a bit of power and a push when we're suppose to be the way the war is solved. Not Midgardsormr. I agree with you that I'd want more answers involving him and all, but I'd also would love more bits about the dragons in general, considering Heavensward lacked any actual attempts to flesh them out in more apparent ways imho.

I'm not sure where you get the idea that Nidhogg wants anything to do with the son of man at that point, even from an "Enemy of my enemy could help screw with my enemy with a nudge" perspective. There's still massive swathes of land in Dravania/Abalathia's spine that they could've bummed around at. Nidhogg (Or rather his shade) does his own dirty work, if Ishgard is going to fall it was with his dying breath (Or again, through "his shade" again and again...).

There's a lot of directions I wish they would've gone with 3.x's dragons, but I really wish we just got more of them. I feel the 3.X series has just been kinda bad writing on the behalf of the dragons and heretics (Who we saw even LESS of). On the contrary, I'm sick of working for Aymeric and Ishgard, but I expect we'll be doing just as much work for them in the upcoming patches as we return to Eorzea proper with the entire unified Alliance.

Originally Posted by Samcaesar

With regards and to the defense of dragons as a massive fan of them in the story I feel like I ought to chime in response...

Middy points out to Hrae that his respect to Nidhogg at this point may be misplaced. The brother he once knew is gone, having lost body and mind to waging war. Hrae may have just needed a reminder that win or lose, Nidhogg is lost, and not even alive anymore. Who does it benefit keeping such mindless destruction?

I kinda wish there was more insight on the dragons or ar least the heretics(would tailfeather be part of them?).

One thing I was thinking, could it be the attempt to take Ala Mihgo from the resistance/Illberd that causes a larger war to result with Eorzea and Garlemeld? As in, the war is not something that is sought, but happens anyway due to the brash actions of "freedom fighters". And unless the Empire just happens to be in dire straits, it will be a long and costly endevour just to keep them out, unless we turn to some...less than hydelyny practices.