1.20 Ease of crafting

[Physic]

If you make some synths automatic then the xp gains from them will be drastically reduced because of the reduced time to perform the synth as well as the reduced amount of variables done during said synth. As it stands now there are perhaps 8-10 variables of hitting standard to get to 100% maybe less maybe more based on what you are synthing and your luck. Also now everyone just spams enter all the time, for tougher synths I skillup on I do keep an eye on it and use Perfection and wait when needed waiting for the best time to attempt to complete the synth.l

But think about if you are Blacksmith 5 and trying to make iron ingots, if it's done automatically then perhaps you'll only have a 10-25% chance at success with a fail producing 25xp nd a success granting 100 xp. Now honestly think about it, would you rather have those synths be automatic with reduced xp gains or would you rather just keep it as it is where your xp gains per synth will range from 200-600 based on it's difficulty. While yes the gear synths would have the manuel crafting, it would just make it that much tougher to lv crafting to make it where parts are done automatically.

I've brought a few classes to 20 and I have become slightly burned out from it, so I'm taking my time, but I do believe that crafting should take this long to accomplish, the skill behind crafting is looking for the best synth and then preparing yourself properly for the long synth haul. The challenge itself comes from when you use what you've learned to produce gear for others and attempt to make HQ and such.

My highest craft is 37 CRP and I have takena break from it to level the other crafts since I am curious about the stories and at the same time interesting in trying to be a master of all trades, which is definitely a long process lol, but once I pull it off I"ll be rewarded with the ability to basically produce anything I'd like which imo is worth the grind we are faced with now.

It's all about patience, there's nothing wrong with the crafting system, it's just the fastest route to leveling is through the button spamming, or you can do guild leves which are "free" and grant additional xp when turned in.

when you hit 40 its 80k tnl, when you hit 45 its like 87k, but the higher you go, the less challenging synths that are available, by the time you hit say 47, you can enter spam and get virtually the same results, but you will probably have to do approx 200 synths per level.

I will admit leves help a lot toward the end, if you select only high level, but really, its a pretty bad grind, with a really thoughtless path.

If as you say, its more about procuring the items and choosing which recipes take best advantage of what you have (which will be a reduced plan without books, subcrafts etc) then essentially everything except the actual process of crafting serves a purpose.

Thats essentially the issue, all your gringing craft is purposeless, what you do while doing it doesnt matter.

Its exactly equivalent to if you got the same EXP for doing Auto attack in battle as you do for doing all sorts of crazy combos, except there is no AA, and no flashy visual effects.
This is the crafting minigame as it stands, a hit the button to level up, but hit it alot a whhhoooolllee lot.

come to think of it, if its going to be a button masher, at least let me hit the the button as fast as i can that might be a little more thrilling

HQing is a different beast though

[KenJammin]

Does anyone have the link to where this is stated? I'm not doubting its existence i've just read over almost all of yoshi-p's stuff and i must have missed it.

[Kiote]

Does anyone have the link to where this is stated? I'm not doubting its existence i've just read over almost all of yoshi-p's stuff and i must have missed it.

To my Knowledge it hasn't been. The only things I've seen, and I read everything, is that HQ mat will guarentee HQ results. Nothing else has been discussed about the future of the crafting system. Of course, we should have heard something last night.. But we didn't..

[Derkatron]

To my Knowledge it hasn't been. The only things I've seen, and I read everything, is that HQ mat will guarentee HQ results. Nothing else has been discussed about the future of the crafting system. Of course, we should have heard something last night.. But we didn't..

Not sure what news you guys are referring to, but this is where the 'no more failures and automated system for even level synths with no hq' concept is coming from:






11. What are you planning on doing about the monotonous crafting mechanics? People literally sit and press enter for hours on end. Why was this specific crafting style chosen over something simplistic and automatic ala World of Warcraft?

Sonomaa (BG): What are you planning on doing about the monotonous crafting mechanics? People literally sit and press enter for hours on end. Why was this specific crafting style chosen over something simplistic and automatic ala World of Warcraft? I hate to keep going back to World of Warcraft, but they're winning.

Square-Enix: It's a matter of priority so far. For the past 10 months, we prioritized all of the things we thought we needed to get fixed first. On the top of that list: UI, Battle System. Also, Content, where the content was based on Guildleves. So, over the past 10 months, it has been fixing the things that needed fixes and adding more content. With the Crafting System, again, we prioritized what needed to be fixed first. The first thing that needed to be fixed was that the Recipe System was way too complex - way too many ingredients, way too many steps to get to your final product. Something that was way too difficult for the novice player to get into. You would have to be hardcore if you wanted to make something. So getting those things fixed first was our priority.

[Yoshida speaks more]

And he's going on more; it's the amount of materials you needed. It wasn't just pressing Enter, it was having to get ALL of these materials before pressing Enter. And so the next step, which we hope to do really soon, is now shorten the number of steps to actually do the crafting. Instead of, you know, sitting down, doing the thing, standing up, getting your stuff, etc. Consolidate all of it and cut down on the steps is the next step being taken.

And one of the things we're planning is two different crafting systems. One that's very simplified and that you're going just for the item you need without having to worry about High Quality, with a small chance of High Quality. Then there's the other system, where it will take more time and effort, but the chance of getting that High Quality item will become higher. So the people who want to spend more time and do it carefully will have the higher chance of a High Quality, and then the people who want to get it done, they have the consolidated system.

BG: Will you be abolishing breaks? Like FFXI had breaks, where you could lose everything and it was heartbreaking.

SE: Yes, we've already begun discussing removing that loss probability. If it's below, at, or just a bit above your crafting level, then the loss probability would be removed. But if it's something far above your crafting level - if you succeed, then you get the experience bonus, but if it is far above your level, having those item lost are a good way...

BG: Agreed. Good.

SE: That's the standard, and we hope to get to that. That's what we're thinking.

BG: I just hated making arrows with my Ranger in FFXI that were 30 points below and blowing up the whole thing. Why am I blowing up my arrows?

SE: [Discussion and laughs among the SE staff] We'll take that into consideration.

Full interview is here:

http://www.bluegartr.com/threads/107...-Transcription

[emblasochist]

Personally, I have a few things to argue about your concerns.

First off, not everyone WANTS to be a crafter. I know a lot of people who couldn't give a damn about crafting in MMOs. Not everyone will just because it's the best way for an individual to wear their war/magic classes' armors.

There are also some people that WANT to craft more than they want to play a war/magic class. Personally, I fall into the category that prefers the crafting and gathering over combat. I still play a pugilist, but that's because it's what I started as and there's some things that you have to rank up in combat classes to be able to experience the fun stuff of the game, be it a company chocobo or raids or whatever.

Not everyone would do automated crafts all the time; I personally would do it just when I needed to grind through a bunch of mats I had that were burning a hole in my slots, because, in spite of the failures, I LIKE the crafting and gathering minigames.

Not everyone pays attention to the economies of their servers. Just a couple days ago I bought a stack of zinc ores from a retainer for ~ 10k, whereas it vends for ~ 1k a piece. That's the lowest I've seen it on Mysidia, true, but the economy is broken in MMOs in general. There's always people making profits from selling their wares on AH when you can buy it from a merchant for pennies on the dollar, and there's also people that sell stuff at deep "discount", because they don't need the gil as much as they need the space.

Furthermore, HQ'ing still looks like it won't really be SIMPLE for anyone just because they powerleveled their crafts to 50 and bought the best tools. You'll still need to know how to actually craft well, from my understanding, rather than just knowing to break your enter key...

That said, if everyone DID have the inclination to level their crafts to max once automation is implemented, it'd have some of the effects you mentioned. Sure, guild marks will eventually become worthless. Guild support and treatises will be killed, and crafting will become less acknowledged as a class, but again, IFF EVERYONE just decides to grindcraft to 50 in their crafts...

Personally, I think that some people will never bother picking up a pickaxe or a chaser hammer, and some won't just automate their crafts, because automating them doesn't teach you how to HQ.

[Kiote]

Not sure what news you guys are referring to, but this is where the 'no more failures and automated system for even level synths with no hq' concept is coming from:

Don't have time to read the full article atm, but what you quoted does not mention automated crafting at all. It mentions making NQ Faster and Easier with a minimal chance of HQ.

[Derkatron]

"SE: Yes, we've already begun discussing removing that loss probability. If it's below, at, or just a bit above your crafting level, then the loss probability would be removed. But if it's something far above your crafting level - if you succeed, then you get the experience bonus, but if it is far above your level, having those item lost are a good way..."

Removing the possibility of loss in a 'very simplified' crafting scenario for NQ recipes sounds like an instant completion to me (a minigame with no risk of failure and no chance of HQ would be COMPLETELY pointless). So while there's no way to know if it's automated or not (I apologize for using that word, I was just trying to tie it into the discussion) it definitely sounds like a non-minigame, zero-risk, instant completion way of crafting for moderate xp gains. Which is SPECTACULAR, in this lala's opinion.

[Jinko]

Don't have time to read the full article atm, but what you quoted does not mention automated crafting at all. It mentions making NQ Faster and Easier with a minimal chance of HQ.

Does faster and easier not suggest automated to you ?

Obviously you do need to read between the lines a bit and thats never advisable lol but I can't see what else they have in mind.

[WinterSkyblue]

I personally was attracted to FFXIV due to the depth of the crafting system.

I am touch by this sentence. Yes, me too!

If SE just modify the crafting system like those SH--IT childhood like RPG game, I will leave this game.

SE, let me tell you something:

Around me and my LS, >80% people love battle, they rank up all their battle jobs in 3-4 months and leave even before 1.6, me and my friends those love crafting and gathering states in this game for whole year.

Yes, after 1.19, some of those battle field people back, but will they pay for this game? or how long will they play? Most of them said they will pay for 1-2 months to try new battle system / new monster and then leave again. Only those crafting and gathering people said will pay for long time (>6 months).

So even crafting and gathering player is minor, but we are repeating customer. How would you treat us like nothing!? Just to please those battle field players, removing the distinguishing features and then turn FFXIV alike those childhood-like RPG game.

[Kiote]

The Crafters and Gatherers are the only reason this game didn't get pulled. The vast Majority of people who didn't like Crafting or Gathering quit. Yet for some reason, Yoshida feels the need to punish us for staying in the hopes that it will make the people who will never like crafting come back.. Asinine.

It's Ok to make something easier in the hopes of bringing in more people. But it is not Ok to remove the experience of dedicated players to coerce people who can never be satisfied.

Most people will not like crafting unless you remove the levels and let them make whatever they want all the time. Auto-crafting moves way to far in that direction.