On AST cards, AOE vs others

[FunkYeahDragons]

Am I missing something on PVE AST while leveling it again? I've had people commenting on how I rarely/never use AOE now.

I don't use AOE Balance/Arrow in leveling dungeons because of
* Reduced potency
* Little things like getting it up BEFORE SMN applies buffs, or all it does it buff Ruin
* It's easy to get something like Enhanced Balance on one DPS and regular Arrow on the other for trash pulls
* My/the tank's speed/damage doesn't have as much of an impact, especially with only a 5% increase

I'd see the benefit in something like AOE Balance in a raid, where it's affecting four DPS, two tanks, and potentially two Cleric Stance healers, but not Stone Vigil.

[DarkmoonVael]

Expanded royal road in 4 man content is no where as near as powerful as it is in 8 man content. Also, the cards that you royal road to aoe (spire and ewer) can be more powerful if used for MP/TP restoration in 4 man content rather than royal road. Ewer is good to help your gravity spam going, spire is useful for TP users aoe dps in pulls.

You are doing it correctly as far as i am concerned.

Give the best aoe dps enhanced/extended arrow/balance for mob pulls.
Give the best single target dps enhanced/extended arrow/balance for bosses.

Also if you have one good dps and one bad dps (or both bad dps) in DF, aoe cards are an utter waste.

[GeekMatt]

I also don't typically Spread buffs in 4man content, at least I don't plan to. But my overall thought process is to put out as many useful buffs as possible, so if the stars line up then I won't hang onto a buff for very long in the hopes of making it extended or enhanced when Spread is available. The sooner you use it the sooner you get another to use and the more support you've offered to the party overall.

I pretty much never use a card on myself unless I've died recently or messed up my MP management. Even multiple raises don't usually warrant it.

[Katlyna]

You're pretty much correct. The exception is if you yourself are doing lots of damage in the dungeon. In which case AE is much better, assuming that you don't have to throw away a card to do it As you started to get at, the absolute most important part of card optimization is throwing away as few cards as possible and keeping your card draw on cooldown. And most certainly passing your cards to people/situations that need them.

[zuzu-bq]

Expanded and Extended royal road lose part of their power on 4-man dungeons. For these kind of content raw cards tend to be more effective since you'll be facing mini encounters multiple times, even Spire is really strong if you deliver it to a TP class that is dealing AoEs that cost a large amount of TP. Using cards on yourself is recommended if you're doing a good amount of damage. Specially Balance on big pulls since Gravity spam can be quite stronger than a lot of other DPS jobs' aoes. Your reasoning is really good, keep doing a good work!

[Oohlalaheals]

I completely disagree with those that argue against using AOE buffs in 4 man content. You should never be out of MP even if you are doing dps and it is very rare for any TP users to run out in 4 man content. I Royal Road Spire/Ewer every single time. I use AOE buffs as an opportunity to add more dps myself also, I typically will switch to Cleric Stance, hit Lightspeed, and throw out as many Gravity's/ Malefic II's as possible. I also try to use Celestial Opposition every time I am able with my AOE buffs, so now you have a buff that's 50% as strong, but on 4x as many people for a longer duration- I fail to see how that is not worth it. Also if you consider there's no way to know which of your damage dealers in a DF group is doing more damage, and therefore there is no way to optimize buffing the dps with single target buffs, it makes a lot of sense to buff everyone.

Edit- Just to add I also use single target buffs frequently- I just also think that AOE buffing is useful and worth it. It all just depends on what is drawn.

[DarkmoonVael]

hit Lightspeed, and throw out as many Gravity's/ Malefic II's as possible. .

This here tells me you still have a lot to learn about AST, as its a terrible terrible thing to do.

You are pressing a button that literally says it decreases you dps before you dps, like why?

Also if you never get to the stage in 4 man content where ewer is beneficial to yourself, you are not pushing your dps or doing it wrong.

[Alex_W]

Ooh lala, I would recommend against using light speed to dps when you spread balance/arrow. Light speed reduces the potency of dps skills but does not change the GCD at all. So you are actually losing dps from light speed and not really pumping them out faster.

Edit: Aaaand Darkmoon sniped my post before I could type it. Lol

[Oohlalaheals]

This here tells me you still have a lot to learn about AST, as its a terrible terrible thing to do.

You are pressing a button that literally says it decreases you dps before you dps, like why?

Ooh lala, I would recommend against using light speed to dps when you spread balance/arrow. Light speed reduces the potency of dps skills but does not change the GCD at all. So you are actually losing dps from light speed and not really pumping them out faster.

I guess I did not realize this regarding Malefic II- I use gravity more frequently in dungeons so I did not give it enough thought, however, it is still worth using lightspeed to spam Gravity- in the 10 second window of lightspeed you can spam 4 Gravity's instead of only 3 in a normal 10 second window- those 4 gravity's even reduced at 25% are still (just slightly) more dps than 3 without lightspeed- but you have saved a ton of MP. If you aren't using lightspeed for anything else why would you not do it?

Edit: And regardless of this side topic about dps- on the original topic of spreading aoe buffs- they are still worth it because again, 50% less buff, but on 4X as many people

[Petori]

I guess I did not realize this regarding Malefic II- I use gravity more frequently in dungeons so I did not give it enough thought, however, it is still worth using lightspeed to spam Gravity- in the 10 second window of lightspeed you can spam 4 Gravity's instead of only 3 in a normal 10 second window- those 4 gravity's even reduced at 25% are still (just slightly) more dps than 3 without lightspeed- but you have saved a ton of MP. If you aren't using lightspeed for anything else why would you not do it?

Edit: And regardless of this side topic about dps- on the original topic of spreading aoe buffs- they are still worth it because again, 50% less buff, but on 4X as many people

Personally I use Lightspeed to put Stoneskin on everyone between pulls whenever it's ready. Anyway you should use Enhanced Balance on your best Damage Dealer because that 15% gives more overall DPS than Expanded Balance.