Live Letter XXX Discussion Thread

[StouterTaru]

How is that any more difficult than "YOU LOSE!"? That's the highest difficulty possible right there. I sure as hell can't beat it. Nobody can.

Are you saying that making the fights require flawless play and teamwork or result in a wipe is a better system? Remember how quickly they nerfed Steps of Faith? And that wasn't even that hard; you could have 3 dead weight party members and still beat it.

Maps are a casual content where you can grab a couple friends and have fun screwing around and doing something a little different from normal instances. There's not enough stuff in the game like and, and it doesn't need to be turned into something that requires a static.

[MomomiMomi]

Are you saying that making the fights require flawless play and teamwork or result in a wipe is a better system? Remember how quickly they nerfed Steps of Faith? And that wasn't even that hard; you could have 3 dead weight party members and still beat it.

Maps are a casual content where you can grab a couple friends and have fun screwing around and doing something a little different from normal instances. There's not enough stuff in the game like and, and it doesn't need to be turned into something that requires a static.

If you chose the wrong door, it gets more difficult. That's it. It's easy until you pick a wrong door. Instead of failing, it gets harder. You might win. You'll probably lose. But you might win.

You can't beat it? Then you lose and end up exactly where the current system would have put you. Nothing is lost here.

[StouterTaru]

If you chose the wrong door, it gets more difficult. That's it. It's easy until you pick a wrong door. Instead of failing, it gets harder. You might win. You'll probably lose. But you might win.

You can't beat it? Then you lose and end up exactly where the current system would have put you. Nothing is lost here.

Except for having useful and rare rewards when you do get lucky.

However, my personal opinion is a puzzle would be best. That is actually a form of game and requires skill/thought to complete. It becoming something that you learn and becomes "faceroll" is no different than learning/mastering any game. I fail to see why mastering a puzzle is even in the same ballpark of poor game-design as an RNG system that decides if you get to move on or not.

Fun loses its fun when it's repetitive, and SE has yet to demonstrate any ability/willingness to create a puzzle that requires more than reading a 3 sentence guide.

[Kaurie]

Fun loses its fun when it's repetitive, and SE has yet to demonstrate any ability/willingness to create a puzzle that requires more than reading a 3 sentence guide.

True, but it being fun for the first few times is infinitely more fun than it being never fun and incredibly frustrating every time.

However, you are definitely right, I have yet to see SE demonstrate the ability to implement a fun, dynamic and engaging puzzle. I have seen quite a few decent ones in WoW, actually. It can be done, if they put their minds to it.

[MilesSaintboroguh]

True, but it being fun for the first few times is infinitely more fun than it being never fun and incredibly frustrating every time.

However, you are definitely right, I have yet to see SE demonstrate the ability to implement a fun, dynamic and engaging puzzle. I have seen quite a few decent ones in WoW, actually. It can be done, if they put their minds to it.

Until the player base throws a fit over it. Steps of Faith. Never forget.

[Kaurie]

Until the player base throws a fit over it. Steps of Faith. Never forget.

To be fair, Steps of Faith was neither a puzzle, nor fun =P

So you see them as a waste of time, yet you had fun during map-days with your FC. I'll go with the assumption that it's because the maps are a great thing for social FC events, where you're just hanging around, digging up treasure, killing some monsters. Doesn't really sound like you wasted your time, if you indirectly had fun, despite the fact that you don't consider maps fun.

As for your last sentence, are you trying to make it sound like you no longer have an issue with the RNG in the Aquapolis?
Sometimes you get something nice and rare [continuing on to the next room, getting more rewards], sometimes you don't. [wrong door, you stop getting rewards until the next time you enter]

I see Treasure maps in and of themselves as a waste of time, and would rather spend time doing other content with people. We had fun doing maps, but we also had fun doing other content. What was fun was doing stuff with friends - similarly to cleaning dishes with friends can be fun as you joke around. Cleaning dishes on its own is not a fun activity.

As for my last sentence, as mentioned, I do not have an issue with RNG in and of itself, I have an issue with how RNG is used in terms of the 50% chance that you choose the right door. It could even be made around speed - maybe if you finish the floor in X seconds, you have a 90% chance of choosing the right door, but if you finish in X+20, it's 80%. X+40 = 70% etc. *shrug*

[MilesSaintboroguh]

To be fair, Steps of Faith was neither a puzzle, nor fun =P



I see Treasure maps in and of themselves as a waste of time, and would rather spend time doing other content with people. We had fun doing maps, but we also had fun doing other content. What was fun was doing stuff with friends - similarly to cleaning dishes with friends can be fun as you joke around. Cleaning dishes on its own is not a fun activity.

As for my last sentence, as mentioned, I do not have an issue with RNG in and of itself, I have an issue with how RNG is used in terms of the 50% chance that you choose the right door.

But it's the result of what happens when you try to do something different.

[Yasuhiro]

To be fair, Steps of Faith was neither a puzzle, nor fun =P

Assuming from your join date and you might not be playing an alt like I am so correct me if I'm wrong, you never did Steps of Faith before it was horribly nerfed because XIV's playerbase can't handle difficult story line bosses that require team work, now people just shoot cannons at the dragon and wail on it til its dead.

[Nezerius]

As for my last sentence, as mentioned, I do not have an issue with RNG in and of itself, I have an issue with how RNG is used in terms of the 50% chance that you choose the right door. It could even be made around speed - maybe if you finish the floor in X seconds, you have a 90% chance of choosing the right door, but if you finish in X+20, it's 80%. X+40 = 70% etc. *shrug*

Again, this would just force people to go with a full group of people, just to make it way easier to ready those time limits, as anything less would be considered a disadvantage.

Just leave it the way it is, and avoid it if you don't enjoy running this type of content.

[Nezerius]

However, you are definitely right, I have yet to see SE demonstrate the ability to implement a fun, dynamic and engaging puzzle. I have seen quite a few decent ones in WoW, actually. It can be done, if they put their minds to it.

Current discussion about the Aquapolis aside, I'm curious if you can list some of these decent puzzles from WoW?

I've played that game for years, up until the SoO content drought made me quit, and again after realizing that WoD was garbage on every front except raiding, and I can't recall any decent puzzles.