Live Letter XXX Discussion Thread

[MomomiMomi]

That's not the whole game in XIV, though... just what happens in a piece of bonus content in which you're virtually guaranteed at least some kind of reward, just not ALL the rewards.

Doesn't change the fact that this could be done better. There's a reason why Jumbo Cactpot has seen a huge decrease in participation. It's the least fun thing there is in the Gold Saucer.

Why accept mediocrity? If something can be improved, people should ask for it to be improved.

Idea #2
The 50% chance to spawn a portal remains, the rewards remain the same as the ones that were announced (7th room giving various grade V materia, and 100,000 gil to every party member). The RNG is adjusted in the sense that you won't get kicked out if you pick the wrong door. Here's the catch to this idea, picking the wrong door places you into a savage-tier version of the next room, so difficult that it's very unlikely for your party to progress past that room. Essentially, you did get screwed over by RNG, but it didn't stop you from progressing entirely.

That's fine as long as it is clearable.

Here's another alternative: Every time you pick the wrong door, it knocks off time from the duty duration timer. I believe it was a 60 duration duty. Let's say -10~15 minutes per wrong door. You're still getting RNG screwed, but it's increasing the intensity of the dungeon by making you have to push harder to clear in time. Ramp up the difficulty while you're at it.

[Nezerius]

That's fine as long as it is clearable.

Clearable by 1% of the playerbase still counts as clearable, right?

There's no point in changing the Aquapolis to be progressively more difficult as you get closer to the 7th room.
Mainly because they're already adding Palace of the Dead in 3.35, a dungeon that becomes progressively more difficult as you move from floor to floor, and requires skill to do. Oh, and there's no RNG to enter the Palace of the Dead!

[MomomiMomi]

There's no point in changing the Aquapolis to be progressively more difficult as you get closer to the 7th room.

Making it more fun is reason enough.

Hey Yoshida. I'm calling you out. Remember this?



Let's go back to making things that are fun, please.

[Khalithar]

Why accept mediocrity? If something can be improved, people should ask for it to be improved.

This particular sentence bears repeating. It's maddening to me when I hear someone make a post about something that could be improved and players actually respond with "well it could be worse" or "it's worse in this other game" as if that somehow makes it acceptable for this one. I don't believe the players should have to settle.

[Yukiko]

SE confirmed they are using a PRNG and not turning it into a TRNG because of server issues (makes it faster if you skip those checks).
We can say the algorithm is implemented right, but used incorrectly!
In common history when games were made for players, developers never relied solely on RNG alone, there was a backup system (example: The more you fail, the higher luck next time). Most games implemented something like "Luck" in their character stats. The higher your luck, the better your chances on loot or well... doors! You can easily check that system in the old MUDs or D&D games.

1) Enemy declares Attack
2) Luck roll to check if you avoid the attack
3) will roll to check your skills (sometimes passive skills)
4) attack roll
5) defence roll
6) damage calculation

you have 1 attack roll and 3 backup systems to help against the RNG.
Furthermore, skills influence the rolls, lets say if you wear a helm you are save when you roll 1, 2, 3 but if you wear an armour you are save with a 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7... you backup RNG with something to negate bad odds because bias from algorithm is very bad when used with MANY users - if you generate a software dice, its fine because you dont roll for so many players - but here we have one RNG for ALL rolls... If you calculate % then you are right when you count in only one player with many rolls for him alone because then it becomes even, but here in ffxiv we dont have "one" player rolling the dice... because its an algorithm you will hit odds more frequently! Between 2 rolls (lets say you do twice /random in chatwindow within 1 second delay) the RNG on server already did hundreds of rolls because you are not the only player that needs a number from him! The Problem here is the "algorithm" and all PRNG have a pattern. Without the backup net you will see a lot odds happening -> crafting because of too many players using the same RNG

The reason Square Enix doesnt program a backup net is because its easier for them and cheaper...

So, TL;DR: server limitations (or developer philosophy, but it's fun to blame everything on server limitations ).

^
Fits to my text too

[MomomiMomi]

Another clarification: Not all RNG is bad. It can be put to good use. Pure RNG is plain awful though. If the only thing that is determining whether you succeed or not is a dice roll, then it's just not fun.

To elaborate on what I mentioned, you could have two different rooms. One is the normal room, the other is booby trapped. It will apply a penalty to your group. Time reduction, Poison (can't clear), Paralysis, Reduced Healing. Etc. This makes it progressively more difficult to continue clearing. Think FF7 Battle Square.

[Yukiko]

To elaborate on what I mentioned, you could have two different rooms. One is the normal room, the other is booby trapped. It will apply a penalty to your group. Time reduction, Poison (can't clear), Paralysis, Reduced Healing. Etc. This makes it progressively more difficult to continue clearing. Think FF7 Battle Square.

Actually thats a very good Idea!
We had that in FFVII Gold Saucer within the ARENA...
Still one thing to point out: It was clearable even with all negative effects!

RNG is choosing the penalty, if i remember right you always got one after a fight before the next fight. Still, there were some penalties who didnt hurt that much: no more item use allowed, no more magic allowed and so on... while others were hurting really hard -> 1/2 STR or 50% HP ... Ok to be fair: Players have chosen the penalty by stopping the wheel... experienced players could stop it on the penalty they wished for with stopping the wheel in the right time...

Yes please, such a System is much better!

[Nezerius]

Actually thats a very good Idea!
We had that in FFVII Gold Saucer within the ARENA...
Still one thing to point out: It was clearable even with all negative effects!

RNG is choosing the penalty, if i remember right you always got one after a fight before the next fight. Still, there were some penalties who didnt hurt that much: no more item use allowed, no more magic allowed and so on... while others were hurting really hard -> 1/2 STR or 50% HP ... Ok to be fair: Players have chosen the penalty by stopping the wheel... experienced players could stop it on the penalty they wished for with stopping the wheel in the right time...

Yes please, such a System is much better!

This idea, while being neat, would make more sense if they ever end up adding the Battle Square in this game's Gold Saucer.
Considering they're already experimenting with solo content (Palace of the Dead), it wouldn't be a stretch to think that the Battle Square could become an option, if the Palace ends up as a successful feature.

The whole "spinning the wheel to choose your penalty" wouldn't even make much sense in the Aquapolis, that sounds more of an amusement park kind of thing. (exactly why it'd fit right in with the Gold Saucer)
It'd have to be reduced to a randomly booby trapped room, without the player having any choice in the matter. These traps would have to be equally serious, and actually have a good chance that the average group will fail at clearing the room (they did pick the wrong door, after all), and perhaps having it affect the reward in the 7th room. (something along the lines of "Triggering the trapped room has caused part of the 7th room to collapse, resulting in 10% of the riches to disappear")

[MomomiMomi]

It'd have to be reduced to a randomly booby trapped room, without the player having any choice in the matter. These traps would have to be equally serious, and actually have a good chance that the average group will fail at clearing the room (they did pick the wrong door, after all), and perhaps having it affect the reward in the 7th room. (something along the lines of "Triggering the trapped room has caused part of the 7th room to collapse, resulting in 10% of the riches to disappear")

So exactly what I said? Okay.

[Reynhart]

This idea, while being neat, would make more sense if they ever end up adding the Battle Square in this game's Gold Saucer.

Isn't this concept part of the Palace of the Dead ?