Difficulty of ALC potions

[cgbspender]

Maybe that's because no one's feedback is matching Mindy's point about Alc recipes (Whom I agree with 200%). Anyone willing to mass-craft these isn't a casual crafter. They are either crafters for world-progression statics, or world-progression crafting.

[panderin]

Maybe that's because no one's feedback is matching Mindy's point about Alc recipes (Whom I agree with 200%). Anyone willing to mass-craft these isn't a casual crafter. They are either crafters for world-progression statics, or world-progression crafting.

I don't disagree with Mindy but it doesn't seem to be a discussion per say. Everyone in one way or another has dissatisfaction with yields on pots across the board and the difficulty is obnoxious for what you get for ROI. I don't think there is much of a discussion to be had that is why I feel like this will be addressed sooner rather than later. I feel like at this point it is beating a dead horse.

[PROBOUND]

You cant make everyone happy. Everyone can agree that yeild is the only issue here. The dev's have confirmed this with the upcoming changes to yeild in 3.3. For that i'm happy. If your not happy, maybe its time to switch specialists. ALC probably isn't for you.

[Mindy_Macready]

Everyone can agree that yeild is the only issue here.

No, it's not the only issue. Potions should not require the same timesink as raid-level gear to craft, because they only last 15 seconds, and are consumed constantly throughout a group's progression.

Given the fact that ALC specialists are the only ones able to craft the highest potions at the moment, they should be given some sort of respite from crafting difficulty so their entire week isn't spent crafting for their raid group or FC. Yield alone will not accomplish this, given the rotations necessary for 3-star crafts.

This is why I keep pointing to x-pots as the gold standard for potions; introduced at the same time as 3-star crafts, yet kept as 2-stars, even when 100% rotations existed. It just required a heavy investment in gear.

When the new gear is released in 3.3, and (if) d-pots get the yield increase, then they will replace x-pots because of the difficulty.

[Sollux]

No, it's not the only issue. Potions should not require the same timesink as raid-level gear to craft, because they only last 15 seconds, and are consumed constantly throughout a group's progression.

From a business point of view, potions have an extremely long market life compared to almost any other item due to being a single use, finite resource that is almost always in demand regardless of the tier of potion. X-pots are STILL profitable over 2 years after their release, and despite being single yield drac pots STILL sell well on Tonberry. The profit margin may not be anywhere near what you would make selling an Endgame combat set, but a single player could theoretically buy hundreds if not thousand of pots whereas they will only ever need 1 of each set (disregarding Spirit Bonding). Why should they be easier to Craft than any other class?

Given the fact that ALC specialists are the only ones able to craft the highest potions at the moment, they should be given some sort of respite from crafting difficulty so their entire week isn't spent crafting for their raid group or FC. Yield alone will not accomplish this, given the rotations necessary for 3-star crafts.

Yield alone WILL accomplish this. Let's math, shall we?

HQ Potions have a CD of 4 minutes 30 seconds. Let's assume you raid for 3 hours a night, twice a week. If you used a pot the second it came off cooldown for 6 hours straight you'd go through 80 pots, but during an actual raid that number is more likely closer to 60 due to downtime from mechanic discussion, holding for phases, shenanigans, etc..

Now let's assume yields get increased to 3 per Craft, and you can HQ one every minute. Not only is this possible, with the proper gear and manual Crafting it can be done in even less time with only a few HQ mats to almost guarantee HQ. In 20 minutes you would be able to Craft enough pots for a weeks worth of raiding, hardly something I'd consider a timesink. You argue that it's a huge timesink when an ALC has to Craft enough pots for their entire raid team and/or FC and you're not wrong (it would take around 2 hours and 40 minutes to Craft 60 pots for 8 people), but I wouldn't expect this from any Crafter without some kind of payment being involved, in which case it's up to the Crafter to decide whether it's worth their time or not.

If you're in a position where you feel forced to Craft massive amounts of pots for your FC and/or raid team for little to none to negative profit then you're being taken advantage of and either need to stop Crafting for them or demand some form of payment to make it worth your time.

When the new gear is released in 3.3, and (if) d-pots get the yield increase, then they will replace x-pots because of the difficulty.

You're probably right, but for the wrong reason. Drac pots will replace x-pots purely because the drop in price per pot will make them much more enticing, and the same holds true for max pots. The "difficulty" of the Craft will likely become a non-issue with the new Crafted gear being released at the same time as well.

Tl;dr, Pots are profitable BECAUSE they're used so often, max-pots are not a timesink unless you make them one, and yield IS the biggest issue.

[Cleanse]

...

Tl;dr, Pots are profitable BECAUSE they're used so often, max-pots are not a timesink unless you make them one, and yield IS the biggest issue.

Amen. Your example is also being overly generous with how many pots people would use per week. Loads of people I know doing progression aren't using the best pots until they have nailed a strat down. Xpots etc are used in order to simulate pot timing.

[PROBOUND]

Snip

+1 Couldnt have said it any better myself! Mindy, /uninstall if you still dont understand.