Would you like an in-game parser?

[Dzian]

Last time I did OS4 with a pug I had a DD who was doing 3600 DPS. They did 0 mechanic mistakes and had 0 deaths. We beat the fight, but if everyone would have been playing like they did, we would not have been able to beat the fight. Now some of us were performing much higher and we were able to carry them through. Does that seem fair to you?.

To be honest if he never died and never made any mechanical mistakes you can't really fault the guy that much.

I mean sure his dps might have been a bit low but I'd rather have that guy in my group than a guy who's screwing up mechanics and putting the rest of the party in jeapordy / causing wipes because he doesn't know what to do.

And if you cleared the fight it's all good. You could have replaced him with a guy that does more dps but screws up mechanics and thus caused your group several wipes and prevented you from clearing.

[Taika]

To be honest if he never died and never made any mechanical mistakes you can't really fault the guy that much.

I don't agree. I think (in Savage / Ultimate / Extremes!) it's the responsibility of every party member to aim to perform well enough so that if everyone else would play like you, the party would be able to beat the fight (if it's a clear or farm party, not learning). Handling mechanics is a part of that, but so is DPS. It's not right to make your group work extra hard because you can't do your own part. It shouldn't be a choice between a party member who can't handle their DPS rotation and a party member who can't handle mechanics - we should be able to expect both at this level of content (again, when it's a farm / clear party, not practice).

That said, if I had known their DPS beforehand, I would still have taken them in (since I knew I had people who were able to carry, and the person would have gotten a chance to improve their rankings). However, they had hidden their rankings, which means they were aware of their exceedingly low performance and instead of being honest about it, had chosen to hide it from others. That's what I don't appreciate. They should have just done more practice and improved their performance before sneaking in to weekly farm groups.

[akaneakki]

And if you cleared the fight it's all good. You could have replaced him with a guy that does more dps but screws up mechanics and thus caused your group several wipes and prevented you from clearing.

Clone the guys dps into 3 others and it wouldn't be cleared.

[MoroMurasaki]

I mean sure his dps might have been a bit low but I'd rather have that guy in my group than a guy who's screwing up mechanics and putting the rest of the party in jeapordy / causing wipes because he doesn't know what to do.

If you're saying you'd rather have someome with slightly lower DPS but who is very proficent at mechanics over someome who has higher DPS but is eating avoidable damage everh chance they get I'm with you for 99% of content.


What you have to understand is that the enrage timer (in a fight that has enrage) is also a mechanic. Tbe DPS that Taika mentions did have one mechanical error - they weren't beating enrage.

Now since the group was strong they still cleared the fight but in the same train of thought a strong group could likely compensate for someone less well versed in mechanics (to an extent, I know O4S is very mechanic heavy) because a good group is a good group no matter the circumstances.

Just remember - it's all well and good to want to include everyone but in doing so you may find you're punishing yourself for no real benefit. If Taika's group had been comprised of 4 mechanically sound 3600 DPS players that run would have wiped to enrage every time. It's the other 7 people in the group who made that clear happen.