Would you like an in-game parser?

[Seraphix2407]

,...

There are times you can do enough and never die and still kill it without knowing your dps. The real question is, what if you did so low compare to the others and they made up for your loss. Do you think that's acceptable. Read my post that i wrote few mins up there. You go in a group with your same type of dps but wont kill it. Do know what the issue is? The damage. You go in a new group where everyone does 600-700 more than you but you kill it, acceptable? Don't go around and think everyone will accept the fact you can just get a freepass by kill because you didn't pull enough. I'm okay people screwing up and kill it with way lower than they should be if its 1 clear run, but if it's a farm I kindly ask them to leave, because I will NOT tollerate bad attitude towards the group, letting everyone play at their best while the last guy slack. Toxic and selfish and what many of you guys talks about parser people, just bad seed for the community.

You know those guy that will be left out? They will be with or without parsers, simply because they wont get gud. If that's what you guys worry about I mean.

[Krissey]

Id like to see that quote somewhere, people letting healers drop down to 50 hp and then defend the healer.

edit 2: Sorry Cnidarian for edting few times.

As a tank, when you get a healer that thinks they're a DPS. (As in Cleric Stance on, lets your health drop to 50 every single mob pull before healing, etc.)



When you look at the crappy healer's search info, and see they have all combat classes to level 60.

Euhm, I don't want to turn this thread into a healer dps debate thread, but that healer was obviously a better player then you.

but did you die

50... what? 50% hp? As a healer main, I'll say that's totally acceptable/normal before switching to heal you in a normal pull situation, if they know what they're doing. o_O I normally start casting heal when the tank is at about 60/70% so my heal comes through once they hit 50ish%. Even then, some may say that's too soon. (though, I find myself struggling to balance DPS/Heal with SCH, and trusting the fae... my least fav of the healer classes >_> #canttrustthemfaeries)

If your hp was down to 10% (and possibly more) by the time that heal reached you, (IE, damage is flying like crazy and hp drops super fast before and after the cast), and you're popping cool downs properly, all the time, then that's different. Then they need to re-evaluate when they can DPS (or to stay healing only if it's really that much damage going on) in that particular mob...

By letting me get down to literally 50 health points every mob? NOT 50%. 50 health points. Also "that player is better than you" isn't a debate. I guess you're a troll.

I meant literally 50 health points nearly every mob. And I always use my cooldowns asap and make sure I have up-to-level gear.

Seeing the other responses to my post, that a healer like that is just fine, jeeze I hate this community sometimes.

Yes. Several times.
It wouldn't matter anyway, a healer that lets their tank get down to 50 health points (not percent) sucks at their job. And yes, I was using all my cooldowns and had gear and all that.

You can't get mad at us when you present the error. When you say 50 we all assume you mean 50%, not literally 50hp. So yes, everyone who was defending the method of healing you when your at 50% and DPSing is just fine. Next time, make sure your 100% clear because I doubt anyone here would commend that unless you never died, in which case you would have zero reason to complain which is also something you left out.

I understood 50 HP from the start.. not sure why everyone thinks its 50% >_>

Jeeze, chill, I wasnt snapping. I wasnt aware that it meant 50 percent. I'm sorry, okay? Do I need to bow down and lick your feet or something? This community is way too darn hostile, ffs. You*all need to calm down and relax, alright?

I was mainly irritated at the person who was like "Theyre a better player than you" because thats just being an a-hole and trying to pick a fight rather than having a debate.

Good, though. Im glad you guys dont actually believe healing at 50 health points is okay, because most of the time the tank does die with healers like that. Even if they dont die, thats just cutting it too close. It's cool to help kill stuff as a healer, but you need to prioritize healing first. If the tank continuously gets down to one hit away from dying, and theyre doing their job right, youre not doing yours.

Anyway, Im out, had enough of people trying to bite my head off over some minor misunderstanding. Good job proving my point once again about this community. -w-

Here are the quotes you asked for. All in a silly gif thread. So yeah. DPS obsessed community much?

TL;DR Tank has the AUDACITY to question a healer not doing their primary job (healing) and gets shit on by the overzealous community for DARING to question a healer that was mostly just DPSing.

[Rawrz]

Here are the quotes you asked for. More incoming.

Overhealing is the devil. Exorcise it with ruthless DPS and the Salty tears of your MT. This is training camp boys, get your butt puckered and your cool downs popped. xD

As an aside, healing your tank up from 10% fills the limit break bar. Our War intentionally holmgangs in raids to get the free boosts.

[Seraphix2407]

Here are the quotes you asked for. All in a silly gif thread. So yeah. DPS obsessed community much?

TL;DR Tank has the AUDACITY to question a healer not doing their primary job (healing) and gets shit on by the overzealous community for DARING to question a healer that was mostly just DPSing.

NO I don't really need more. But I will ask you then I don't wanna talk about it again. Did the tank die? :P hehe.

[Cnidarian]

snip

No worries.

Now while I agree that in Savage and current EX primal setting, the situation you describe sucks and it's also something that is a large problem with clear and farm parties in the PF. There are a lot of players who join these hoping to get a carry without even learning the fight. The only thing having an official parser would do in that scenario is weed those players out. That won't help people get better at all and while not everyone will abuse it, you know there will be quite a sizable amount of people who will do one run, kick those with low dps and replace them (even if their dps is above average for the fight in question).

As an example, I was in a learning party for SephEX and someone was complaining that the WHM was only doing 350ish dps and they wanted to kick them to replace them with one that could do better dps. Others were speaking in favor of this and it wasn't until another person in the group who was also using a parser broke their silence and informed the group that the cohealer wasn't even healing and was focusing 100% on dps while the WHM was both dpsing and solo healing in a learning party (i.e. a lot of unneeded damage going out that could have been avoided). If it wasn't for that one person who was also using a parser speaking up, chances are that WHM would have been booted for no reason. This is something that ACT allows you to see and not something that a basic in game parser will show you. (Unless that parser also showed hps in addition to dps).

Edit - This example was in the first few weeks of SephEX.

[Krissey]

NO I don't really need more. But I will ask you then I don't wanna talk about it again. Did the tank die? :P hehe.

Literally just read all the quotes. But if you want spoilers - yes, multiple times.

My main point being the toxicity is here. It's here on the forums, it's in the game. And there aren't many people using parsers. So all these doomsday scenarios and fearmongering about "teh jerks" is pointless. The apocalypse arrived a long time ago. But the game is still growing. So just let people parse. It doesn't matter. It won't change anything.

[Seraphix2407]

No worries.

Yeah that's pretty silly. But we all know seph isn't excactly healer tight, there is many times you can sit in cleric for a while and do it, not that I will expect it, dont even need the extra dps unless its super tight somehow. Well, for me, it's NOT acceptable to kick someone whos doing 100 ish less than they should that means they are pretty good more than an average player. If they are doing 500-600 less, then I would ask them to leave, because you can't leech around me and get free pass by kills. The fact what you mention is just pure stupid, doing 350 ish as a whm is even good, but you know whats even worse?Those who think they are godsent but are even worse than an average players, those players usually ruins it for many as well. I'm pretty sure you know what I talk about. I talk for my own personal experience, many times I've farmed and we just go on with a guy being 50-100 behind, but if someone is way behind then that person has to leave, simple. I know there will be people kicking out those who are doing great and isn't the top but how many? I rarely see it happens, atleast around on my server. Keep in mind I've also been on Ragnarok and Odin server and you know those servers has one of the top players on Eu servers. But yes, I'm sorry if I ask again sir, but could you kindly explain to me how people could know how they improve in the actual fight/content? I talk about using SSS method, because you and I we both know and I sure hope so :P haha. That SSS doesn't give you any spesific data you actually do in battle content.
Many will be left out even without official parsers, because it already happens. Many are left out for reason and you and I both know very well why.

Literally just read all the quotes. But if you want spoilers - yes, multiple times.

My main point being the toxicity is here. It's here on the forums, it's in the game. And there aren't many people using parsers. So all these doomsday scenarios and fearmongering about "teh jerks" is pointless. The apocalypse arrived a long time ago. But the game is still growing. So just let people parse. It doesn't matter. It won't change anything.

I'm not gonna defend some peoples shitty attitude on these forums, so I will only speak for myself. I'm one of the healers who dps alot in expert dungeons, my tank pulls till the wall is stopping us and that's it. I'm not gonna expect people to do the same when some one else is healing, after all my motto is; best tank mitigatation is a dead mob/boss. You want to talk about toxic people? I have a bunch of many different scenarios like the BLM that refuses to use fire 4 in dungeons and go with bliz 3>fire 3 and it's funny to waste peoples time. Or the Tank who doesn't even overpower adds and let me die as a healer because regen is on, because they say that's how they play. Or that one healer who overheals and has no mp for next pull and blame it on the tank. The list is long. I could go on all day about this matter, but I rather not.

Edit: I wanted to add, why look at the negative sides of a parser when it's the last thing that puts a negative thing into the community? If you want to look at the negative side of everything, dont do trials, roulettes, talk in chat, or do content or even interact with people, let me tell you a secret... they might be bad people?! Shocking right? :P

[Thunda_Cat_SMASH]

The most toxic thing in the game is healer DPS. No need to enable people to intentionally cause wipes anymore than they already do.

[Rawrz]

The most toxic thing in the game is healer DPS. No need to enable people to intentionally cause wipes anymore than they already do.

Yeah, because tanks tanking outside of tank stance, is a completely acceptable thing to do.

[Cnidarian]

snip

Call me old school, but you can always manually parse the data yourself using the combat log. That actually use to be my favorite thing to do in older MMO's. Sit down with the other guild/raid leaders and manually pore over the combat logs to figure out new strategies and ways to deal with difference mechanics. Current technology and how fast information is shared now, this method isn't really viable anymore.


One thing I would like to point out in general, a lot of people are assuming that if they add in a parser, that it will be something like ACT or one of the many addons for WoW and other games. I highly doubt this is the case and at best all you can hope for is something that shows your dps or total damage during the fight.

One compromise I can see for those against a parser and those for it, is to have a screen pop up after you leave the duty displaying all the information. This will prevent toxicity during the run for your DF runs, and will still provide the information you would need to see how you compare. The only downside to this that I can think of is that you will get players who choose to ignore mechanics to push out more damage causing others to pick up the slack. (Example, M2/4 normal where someone willingly takes a height error because they don't want to move, or ignores Enumeration causing unneeded damage).