Would you like an in-game parser?

[Xlantaa]

Reynhart has a point. If you add an in game parser, some people will consider gargabe any DPS wich perfon 10% less than the "optimal" You know is true, you cannot say no. WoW has trhis problem. People is more focus on be top DPS than play for fun, because they know imediately will be blamed if their DPS drops a bit.

Some people in this game seems want turn this game into that, sacrifice fun to do the "optimal" shit. Adding the parser for all in all content, will cause people start demand DPS to everyone, even that guy who plays 1 hour per day to run few dungeons and don't care about high level stuffand only want a little fun for a while.

So, the best solution is add parser personal only.

Or

Add a group parser for preformed parties only and only on high level content (Extreme Primals, Savage, Coil, etc) like Neophyte suggest few post ago, because all people wil lagree ein do it (and if not, the ycan jsut leave party). You don't need a parser for casual content to annoy players that only want play for fun.

This is simple. A meter on random DF parties will cause problems only, and won't help in anything.

[Reynhart]

If you add an in game parser, some people will consider gargabe any DPS wich perfon 10% less than the "optimal"

Why do you use "will" ? It's already there, thanks to personal parsers.
And it doesn't only applies to DPS. PLD was rejected because its DPS was too low, even with a perfect rotation...which is very very basic for PLD anyway...

What could save this game is to remove any damage display, so parsing could be impossible. The potency on skills would be enough to theoryze all you want, and Stone, Sky and Sea would give you a broad estimate on your improvement without actual numbers.

In fact, I'm pretty sure this insane focus on damage parse came way before hard DPS checks...when it was easier to put the blame on low DPS instead of screwing mechanics for reaching an enrage.

[Asmodai]

What could save this game is to remove any damage display,.

That would kill the game in less than a month. What would really save this game is not listening to the vocal minority and give the vast majority of players what they want as far as add-ons which includes parsers.

Which they are going to do, as Yoshi has said several times.

[Reynhart]

That would kill the game in less than a month.

Why ? Because you say so ?

the vast majority of players what they want as far as add-ons which includes parsers.

Actually, I really doubt that is the majority.

Which they are going to do, as Yoshi has said several times.

You mean how he mentionend several times that he doesn't want to give people parsers because some of them will use this for harassment ?

No anti parser person have even mentioned how those people can improve when they aren't willing to learn or look up guides.

Since when "not having a parser" means not "learning" or refusing "to look at a guide".
I'd really like you to explain that since I've personnally never used a parser, yet I checked a lot a guides or videos on how to do better as a Dragoon, and I know that it helped me improve a lot...without a single parser
And I've even used Stone, Sky and Sea to check on my overall improvement...something I actually mentionned,too

[Seraphix2407]

You mean how he mentionend several times that he doesn't want to give people parsers because some of them will use this for harassment ?


Since when "not having a parser" means not "learning" or refuse "to look at a guide".
I'd really like you to explain that since I've personnally never used a parser, yet I checked a lot a guides or videos on how to do better as a Dragoon, and I know that it helped me improve a lot...without a single parser
And I've even used Stone, Sky and Sea to check on my overall improvement...something I actually mentionned,too

Having almost no DPS requirment will deff kill the game, this is nothing he only states just to be funny, it's true. Why are dps there? To deal damage and do rotations and for your reply to me. Many refuses to read guides and still if they do they aren't good enough to do it, then what? Are you sure you do enough as you should tho? I did midas 4 savage as ilvl 220 drg with 220 spear but with some food and pot and small amount of good rng, I managed to do it. That doesn't tell me how I would perform in the actual fight with mechanics, where many and including myself could fail on.
I'm not saying YOU, haven't checked a guide, many doesn't and that's still a problem and how do we fix that?

[Reynhart]

Having almost no DPS requirment will deff kill the game, this is nothing he only states just to be funny, it's true.

Strange because I actually think having such hard DPS requirement like Alex Savage defnitiely killed more of the playerbase than the whole Coil, where DPS requirement where far far less severe.

Many refuses to read guides and still if they do they aren't good enough to do it, then what?

I didn't defend people who refused to improve. It's just that "a parser is mandatory to improve" mentality is just stupid.

Are you sure you do enough as you should tho?

Interesting question. No, I'm not sure of it, but it's actually another problem. Let's say that a DPS check requires 4000 overall DPS. Let's say one DPS does 1000 and manage to do all mechanics. Let's say another DPS does 1500 but screw severals times on that phase. According to you, which one will be kicked ? The one who do enough and not screwing mechanics or the one wo do more than enough but fail the rest.

I'm not saying YOU, haven't checked a guide, many doesn't and that's still a problem and how do we fix that?

You still considered refusing to learn as the same thing as not wanting a parser, which has nothing do with it

Because not seeing yourself progress means you may as well be playing a puzzle game or mario paint.

Except there is a way to see the progress you make...

Or why damage is listed for every weapon in the vast majority of games. People like seeing it.

Several games also don't display actual damage numbers on screen, even though your weapon and skills gives a base number.

I'm sure youre going to say "250 votes out of 600k players proves nothing" and I would respond that the random selection of individuals would equate to a valid opinion poll.

Which it does not. Random selection means nothing in statistics. 250 votes out of 600k players really means nothing.

YoshiP: We’re not going to say we’re forbidding players to use that kind of tool if they make it, but I think that’s really up to the community and players for that decision.

Right, and again, it's way too early to state that the playerbase wants a parser.

If you really want to gove players what they want, you'd allow any player to hide their damage on a personal basis. This way, each player would be able to decide if they want to be parsed or not.

[Asmodai]

Interesting question. No, I'm not sure of it, but it's actually another problem. Let's say that a DPS check requires 4000 overall DPS. Let's say one DPS does 1000 and manage to do all mechanics. Let's say another DPS does 1500 but screw severals times on that phase. According to you, which one will be kicked ?

Well, a proper raid group would keep both of them and work on the phase. Hypothetically though if it was a pug and someone had to be kicked then the one not doing the mechanics would be kicked. That's a pretty easy call. Anyone who would kick the person doing the mechanics and maintaining dps that is sufficient to complete the dungeon would be a moron. However, usually if someone is not doing mechanics their DPS will go down dramatically due to them being dead.

[Seraphix2407]

Interesting question. No, I'm not sure of it, but it's actually another problem. Let's say that a DPS check requires 4000 overall DPS. Let's say one DPS does 1000 and manage to do all mechanics. Let's say another DPS does 1500 but screw severals times on that phase. According to you, which one will be kicked ? The one who do enough and not screwing mechanics or the one wo do more than enough but fail the rest.

Even if 1k dps is done and group manage to kill it, doesn't mean he did enough of his own weight. Keep in mind only 2 days after we beat seph we manages to do it with 7 people, that's 1 guy doing nothing in the entire fight. Things like this can happen, and I've seen it happen plenty of time in groups I don't know. That's why I said 85%. Good example, you join a ravana group back in the days when ilvl was lower, ever dps be pulling 1k plus while one does 550? Is that acceptable? Just because you can kill it, doesn't mean the guy pulled his own job correctly. if he was 800-850 that be better but when you are 450-500 behind everone else, you KNOW very well that's a carry and that's the biggues issue many here speaks of, including myself. Many just socialy accept 1 guy being bad, which is so freaking unfair to a whole group.

Which isn't made. Every time I see a team fail, it's "Oh, we don't have any DPS", because it's easier to keep that on check thanks to a parser.

LIke the other guy said, the guy who dies will anyways do lower dps, no matter what. I only call out people who dies more than he should, if some one is doing less and survives the whole fight but somehow get enrage he has to do more damage. Easy call.

[Ghishlain]

Interesting question. No, I'm not sure of it, but it's actually another problem. Let's say that a DPS check requires 4000 overall DPS. Let's say one DPS does 1000 and manage to do all mechanics. Let's say another DPS does 1500 but screw severals times on that phase. According to you, which one will be kicked ? The one who do enough and not screwing mechanics or the one wo do more than enough but fail the rest.

In the scenario you posed, neither of the two candidates would be immediately up for "kicking" and this train of thought feels more of a loaded question than naught. With that being said, the 1K DPS would be at no risk because he's meeting the requirements necessary to complete the fight and consistently doing the mechanics. However, the higher DPS is at risk because if s/he proves that they are incapable of consistently completing the desired mechanics and would be holding the group back overall through progression if they show they cannot learn how to do the fight properly.

The performance of a DPS (or any role for that matter) is the sum of their ability to perform their role and deal with the fight mechanics. While that ability to perform one's role is transparent in the case of tanks and healers, in the case of DPS that transparency doesn't exist due to a lack of parser DPS measuring tool (really should be called this more than naught since there are some pretty key differences between the two).

[Asmodai]

Why ? Because you say so ?

Because not seeing yourself progress means you may as well be playing a puzzle game or mario paint. There is a reason why no rpg's or at least any rpgs that are even slightly popular do this. Or why damage is listed for every weapon in the vast majority of games. People like seeing it.

Actually, I really doubt that is the majority.

The poll on the front of this page says otherwise. 2/3 of the people who cared to vote voted against your thought process. I'm sure youre going to say "250 votes out of 600k players proves nothing" and I would respond that the random selection of individuals would equate to a valid opinion poll.

You mean how he mentionend several times that he doesn't want to give people parsers because some of them will use this for harassment ?

You can pretend he said that all you want, but it isnt true. What he said is he didnt want to make an official parser but he did say add-ons are going to be put in. As for add-ons with DPS meters he said the below.

YoshiP: We’re not going to say we’re forbidding players to use that kind of tool if they make it, but I think that’s really up to the community and players for that decision.