Would you like an in-game parser?

[Ghishlain]

This isn't an election. It was a poll trying to guage the sentiments of the forum community relative to parsers. If you think that SE is going to implement a group parser with approximately half the community opposed to them, dream on.

I think you're missing my point entirely so, let me try to steer this in a different avenue. This is how I'm interpreting our discussion ATM.

My initial comment was the community would like to see any parser implemented and they don't care which type of parser it is (group or personal).
Your comment was the community doesn't want a group parser.

Upon re-reading the thread / data a little your comment isn't wrong. In the same token, my comment isn't wrong either. We're just having this discussion because we're pretty much misinterpreting the point the other person is trying to make.

To make it clear, while I did vote only for a Group Parser, I am not opposed to a personal parser being implemented either because players should have the tools to gauge their performance.

In the exact same token, there are definitely people who have voted for a personal parser that are not opposed to a group parser because they don't care if their numbers are seen or not seen as long as they have the tool readily available.
^ This is important because without knowing this context, we don't know how many people are actually opposed to a group parser or not. Just because someone votes for "Yes, Personal Parser" doesn't meant they oppose "Yes, Group Parser" and viceversa.

I feel your comment is skewed in bias because you're considering the data without all the context associated with it and almost feels like another option needs to be added just to see how much of the pro parser crowd are either

1. Please, only Personal Parser due to abuse reasons
2. Please, just give me a tool to use so I can gauge my performance

Shame we can't really add that option now but I hope you understand my point.

[LaylaTsarra]

To make it clear, while I did vote only for a Group Parser, I am not opposed to a personal parser being implemented either because players should have the tools to gauge their performance.

Let me make my position clear too, I would not be opposed to a personal parser either.

[Ghishlain]

Let me make my position clear too, I would not be opposed to a personal parser either.

I can already determine this based on the points you've made in your previous comments.

Therefore you are in agreement with my initial comment - the community would like to see a parser implemented. However, the type of parser is still up to debate as per our discussion chain thus far.

[Kallera]

I can already determine this based on the points you've made in your previous comments.

Therefore you are in agreement with my initial comment - the community would like to see a parser implemented. However, the type of parser is still up to debate as per our discussion chain thus far.

Here is a concern with a private parser, it needs to be in a way that players cannot force it into being a public parser, wouldn't it? its kinda why SSS ended up the ways it is(as questionable as it is for prepping someone)

[Zojha]

Here is a concern with a private parser, it needs to be in a way that players cannot force it into being a public parser, wouldn't it?

How would you prevent that? It's the same thing as with the opt-out option someone else mentioned earlier >_>

If you don't want to post your numbers, you'll be assumed a bad player and treated respectively, regardless of what your actual numbers are, just as if you'd hide your DPS if given the option. There's no real difference here.

[Kallera]

How would you prevent that? It's the same thing as with the opt-out option someone else mentioned earlier >_>

If you don't want to post your numbers, you'll be assumed a bad player and treated respectively, regardless of what your actual numbers are, just as if you'd hide your DPS if given the option. There's no real difference here.

Which is kinda why im opposed to any parser...but if one had to be brought in, I would see my comment as a requirement, otherwise whatever the parser is, private or public, becomes irrelevant and it will be eventually be used as a social bludgeon.

[Rawrz]

How would you prevent that? It's the same thing as with the opt-out option someone else mentioned earlier >_>

If you don't want to post your numbers, you'll be assumed a bad player and treated respectively, regardless of what your actual numbers are, just as if you'd hide your DPS if given the option. There's no real difference here.

She says as somewhere... a PC player is in a dungeon parsing.. and doesn't kick anyone nor bring any attention to their dps.


Orrrrr




Rude, bad, players might ask for your dps, but most players will just say their dps, when they feel they did well and not expect you to say yours.

[Zojha]

Rude, bad, players might ask for your dps, but most players will just say their dps, when they feel they did well and not expect you to say yours.

I don't think so - I wager it'd be a common occurrence in runs that don't go particularly swift or smooth. And I wouldn't stereotype those players as rude or bad either - some genuinely want to help, others just want to kick whoever is making this run go 30 instead of 20 minutes. Some people are bad and seek a scapegoat, others are so used to a higher level of play that they take it for granted. Some people might even just want to stroke their E-Peen. Motivations differ.

I just fully expect people who do not want to disclose their DPS if prompted to be treated as if they were bad players, because people like to go with the logic:"There is no reason to hide something if you aren't doing something bad.".

[Ghishlain]

Here is a concern with a private parser, it needs to be in a way that players cannot force it into being a public parser, wouldn't it? its kinda why SSS ended up the ways it is(as questionable as it is for prepping someone)

If I were to do a personal parser, I'd make it so there is no optional way to suddenly make it a group parser. But I don't think that's quite what you're asking for based on the next few posts so I'll try to expand on this differently.

If S-E were to implement an official parser, it would be nice if they also release a minimal expected DPS per dungeon to go along with that. That means up and coming new players can see what the minimal bar is set to and try to match that. This isn't to different then the intent SSS tries to set but it's a bit more global (ie stamped right onto the Duty Finder in big bold red letters). This bar will obviously be set much lower than what EX Primals and Savage Raids require.

The reason I suggest a minimal requirement as a shield mechanism against abuse. People will perform at various levels depending on their skill, gear, and let's say "distractions". Some of the more elitest / toxic players will believe if X player isn't reaching their particular standards, it'll be deserving of a kick. With S-E taking said standards into their own hands, it would keep the "entitlement factor" of the more elitest / toxic players in check and still give grounds to plausibly kick an "under performing player" without repercussion.

And while I am not against a personal parser, I do feel a group parser is the better way to go. A group parser allows a level of transparency that you wouldn't get in a personal parser. I've used this as an example in the past - a friend of mine was doing EXDR on BRD in the late AAR-patch era and got paired up with another BRD. During the dungeon the group wiped to a mechanic and this other BRD began to badger my friend about their rotation and DPS. Then the tank piped in and told the other BRD to "Hey, you know that BRD you're badgering is doubling your DPS, right?". The comment silenced the other BRD quite quickly. If a group parser was available that entire conversation would've been avoided and everyone would've gone on their merry way. In the same token, a group parser would easily allow everyone to identify who is under performing and "deal with it" accordingly pending how that conversation goes (if said under performer is trolling to the max... well, you know how that's going to go). In contrast, a personal parser can lead to bad assumptions such as "Well, you're not telling us your number so you're automatically bad" which also isn't very constructive.

A group parser can also be a motivator for newer players. Say an i145 DRG gets matched up with an i200 DRG in Fractual and notice that the i200 DRGs DPS is WAAAY up there compared to their own. That could show the new DRG what their job is capable of and encourage them reach that point. Sure it could be argued that it can be discouraging initially but every player should be striving to become better and this just gives them a new goal to reach.

TDLR: Give a group parser w/ S-E providing the bar to minimal contribution would be how I would implement a parser in FFXIV to minimize harassment issues.