Would you like an in-game parser?

[Alberel]

I used to be opposed to parsers in this game but I've grown increasingly convinced that some metric by which to grade a player's performance within a group is sorely needed. There are far too many players now who pull the group down whilst genuinely believing they are playing well. They will only use half of the skills they should be to perform optimally and yet if you call them out on it they'll get defensive because they don't think they're the problem. These players typically live in some kind of bubble of denial and blame the rest of the group for their failures, convincing themselves that they don't need to improve.

Without some metric by which to show player performance these players will NEVER be forced to accept that they are the weak link, and as a result these players are becoming more and more common.

Yes, some people may end up being harassed as a result of poor performance, but I would imagine the occurrences of that would be far fewer than the current harassment of mentors trying to advise a player that cannot accept they can't play well. I see parsers as no different to the vote-kick feature in that regard. Before vote-kicking was implemented people screamed the house down that vote-kicking would be abused, and yes it is abused, but it is abused far less often than trolls used to abuse parties by going AFK at the entrance of dungeons.

The pros of parsers FAR outweigh the cons, and as the average skill of this community continues to fall we desperately need them to give players incentive to finally try and improve.

[MeiUshu]

snip

It doesnt need to be public you can take your figures and ask your friends if they are ok. That would be acceptable. Is already the case today that people berate other for what they see on their parsers as wrong
. Also people will not help they will just get rid of the player that has figures low so that they can finish their run. The person kicked will still have no clues why. This happening is so predictable... no parsers ever other then personal. No matter what you say i still am of the opinion that you want a mean to pass a judgement not a mean for betterment this based on the *some will be bullied* you still support this even you try to say is not the case. Nothing justifies this not in a game not anywhere and giving a tool that will allow this is wrong. The good willnot outcome the bad in this. I mean is not like we dont have examples already on how people interact with ithers when they have power right? You want one more?

[whiteblade89]

As a filthy casual and someone who only does the normal tier raids, I would be cool with a personal in-game parser. It would help me perfect my rotation, but then again I like to know that I'm doing the maximum deeps I can possibly do. Not everyone is like me though. I actually care, and some don't. Which is their prerogative. A group wide parser is, however, a terrible idea. That's just asking for trouble.

[JDR388]

No one that is pro-parser here wants it so they can bully people.

Isn't one of the primary points of the argument that you can use the parser to push others to play better? Consider that in dungeons you cannot send private messages to each other so any communication you have is public with the rest of the party. I am curious how you envision a conversation like that playing out. Even with the best intentions I think that it is very difficult to have that conversation without coming across as though you want to shame the individual which is really just bullying by other means. So I think your point about bullying, whether it is intended or not, is moot because the conversation itself will be more frequently read as bullying and shaming regardless of its intention.

Furthermore your numbered points consistently lean on the assumption that the majority of the playerbase actually wants to improve. I know from my experience as an educator that there is a very big difference between a student who wants to learn and a student who does not. No numerically based metric is going to make someone want to improve, especially if they have already learned that improvement is not necessary for the kind of content they want to play. In this sense you are also asking for players to conform to your idea of what a "good" player is but a "good" player may not mean a player that does the best dps to everyone.

That said I honestly couldn't care less about whether a parser is in the game or not. The opposite argument has equal problems and is often mired in emotional appeals. I think you might be better off attacking those points instead.

[SeriouslySalty]

Also people will not help they will just get rid of the player that has figures low so that they can finish their run

How can you be so sure? Even today there are people willing to help in dungeons. Maybe I'm just lucky but I rarely see people verbally abused in DF.

No matter what you say i still am of the opinion that you want a mean to pass a judgement not a mean for betterment this based on the *some will be bullied* you still support this even you try to say is not the case.

Well then I believe the conversation between you and I is over. Even though that is not my intention at all, and I've made that clear several times, nothing I say can possibly change what you think my intentions are. You simply keep bringing up the fact that it will be abused. I will not be responding to any more of your posts, but thank you for opening my eyes on how needlessly sensitive this community can be.

[Istaru]

It doesnt need to be public you can take your figures and ask your friends if they are ok. That would be acceptable. Is already the case today that people berate other for what they see on their parsers as wrong
. Also people will not help they will just get rid of the player that has figures low so that they can finish their run. The person kicked will still have no clues why. This happening is so predictable... no parsers ever other then personal. No matter what you say i still am of the opinion that you want a mean to pass a judgement not a mean for betterment this based on the *some will be bullied* you still support this even you try to say is not the case. Nothing justifies this not in a game not anywhere and giving a tool that will allow this is wrong. The good willnot outcome the bad in this. I mean is not like we dont have examples already on how people interact with ithers when they have power right? You want one more?

Seriously???

If I follow you correctly, if a good MNK does 2,000 DPS, and I get one at 1,500 I'm going to kick them for low DPS so I can finish my run?

Seriously???

I have played with enough ice mages and other people that do not follow rotations, do not buff or debuff, or do much of anything and I haven't kicked them. I tried to help a few, the responses have been from "It's my $15, I'll play as I want!!", to "F you elitist!" or other grief. That is why many people don't bothe to try and help with what they see, even without a parser.

You know, a BLM using Fire I > Flare > waits for Astral Fire to drop and start Regen, Blizzard I > repeat. It is painfully obvious that they don't know what they are doing.

I do think that SE needs to let people who were kicked know why they were voted out.

[SeriouslySalty]

.

What I really mean when I say "bully" is verbal abuse, I should have made that more clear. I don't think that constructive criticism can classify as bullying. I guess you are right in that regard that a simple statement of "monk use your rockbreaker" can be interpreted as bullying seeing as how everyone is so sensitive to everything these days.

My points were aimed at people that are actively looking to improve. Of course there will be people that won't want to improve no matter what, but that's not the demographic the parser is aimed towards. There will also be players that would look to improve with a parser; seeing their numbers might give them motivation to doing higher DPS. Being a good player is more about being mechanically sound. When you have two DPS on your team that you believe are already mechanically sound, how do you compare them after that? With how much damage they are doing, of course.

[Khemorex]

Look, if someone is so thin skinned that they can't handle criticism over a video game then they probably should not be playing it.

just coz its the internet does it mean that you have to forget ur manners ^^

I think people should work more on their rage control ability first , but thats just me :P

[Khemorex]

Seriously???

/shrug i had these people do and so what? the world burned down? :P

[TaranTatsuuchi]

I'm pretty sure I've stated my opinion earlier in the thread, I must have as I'm subscribed to it...


A parser is just a tool.
A parser is neither good nor bad.

How people act with the information the parser provides is their own responsibility.
If someone harasses someone else, they deserve to be reported, parser or no.

Some people will just be toxic no matter what tools they have available.