Would you like an in-game parser?

[Miste]

Anyone with half a brain knows that bots are so rampant 30-40% of pc users use rotation bots

Got some proof to back up your "statistics"?

[FabricioRF]

Are antiparsers afraid of people being able to see their low numbers or what?

[Frowny]

Are antiparsers afraid of people being able to see their low numbers or what?

Maybe? On one hand some concerns are valid. On the other, it is pretty easy to see who is being carried even without a parse...

Nonsense post

I too can make a snarky edit!

-Cheesing with pots/food? Erm... in Savage that can be a HUGE benefit and... kind of the point of them. Should I remove my melds as they inflate my stats?
-You know why people can beat A12S without beating the dummy? Crits, people DPSing slightly higher to compensate etc.

If someone is going to attempt EX/Savage, I don't care if they're 13 or 50. They need to push the DPS needed. If they can't, then the content isn't for them.

Also, parsers are technically allowed. It is when they're used to harass when someone gets in trouble for... well, harassment. And I think you said it best, so I'd heed your words:

Why bother post nonsense?

[RobbieH]

Are antiparsers afraid of people being able to see their low numbers or what?

Why bother post this when you're a low parser yourself?

Yes, i too am guilty of using pots and food to "cheese" my numbers. I'm also one of those guys that likes to use my skills in the right order to "cheese" my numbers as well. Clearly i need to stop my epeeen leetness.

Good job for being the only person in the game who "uses skills in the right order", are you going to teach me playing Ninja, please?

People use pots to cheese their DPS yes, for a simple reason, so they get better numbers on a certain website, are pots needed for A9S, A10S and 11S? No they aren't, if people use them is either:

- To have higher numbers
- Because they don't meet the DPS checks needed

People even use Pots om bosses in 24 Man Raids so they can be at the Top.

(Edit ) and I'm not asking for parser so I can grief 13 year olds. I'm wanting a parser so i can track my own dps

Maybe you won't, but many will, people already do it without a parser so with one would be far worse.

(Edit 2) i also don't need a parser to see if a blm sucks or a bard sucks or a drg sucks or a smn sucks. I can actually see if they are doing their job somewhere close to decent.

Then why do you need a parser? It's like everytime you post, you kill your own argument, i just don't get it.

I too can make a snarky edit!

-Cheesing with pots/food? Erm... in Savage that can be a HUGE benefit and... kind of the point of them. Should I remove my melds as they inflate my stats?

No but people like to bring their epeen when they do more DPS when they don't take into account the Stats on whoever is doing less than they should, are you going to deny this? Then you're going to kill your own argument.

-You know why people can beat A12S without beating the dummy? Crits, people DPSing slightly higher to compensate etc.

More or less yes, Crits and LB, LB is used to compensate low and/or DPS losses.

That's why the actual numbers in Savage are lower for the most part compared to the Dummy.

If someone is going to attempt EX/Savage, I don't care if they're 13 or 50. They need to push the DPS needed. If they can't, then the content isn't for them.

Here's what's wrong with this community, you people expect others to perform well, if they don't they get booted, why not help them perform better?

That's why most JP community is successful, because they help each other.

Also, parsers are technically allowed. It is when they're used to harass when someone gets in trouble for... well, harassment. And I think you said it best, so I'd heed your words:

Are they now? Post a link to them in the forums and you'll see if they're allowed.

And come on, people harass each other even without parsers, even there's someone saying that when WoW got parsers it became super toxic, why would it be different here?

Look at this thread, people talking about parsers and running with pitch forks against those who are against it.

I'm not entirely against and in-game parser, i've explained multiple times, per page, what's the problem of adding one, and people in this forum like to skip arguments when they have nothing to counter those arguments, but that's ok, i'm not expecting people to bother considering what they post.

Going to repeat for the last time:

- Parsers won't make a player become much better (to the point people expect them to perform in End-game raiding) on their own, they will still need someone's else help
- Written and Video Guides are much better and faster way to learn
- People with low DPS will get kicked and Vote Kick will be abused more than ever
- There's Mentor System, no one uses it at all, and those who do is for the mount

If the things mentioned above weren't an issue, then i'd be fine with the parser, the problem is that it's in people nature to shit on others even if they're only doing better by 1%.

[Train88]

I wouldn't mind if they put in a parser that shows only your own numbers.

I know from other games that if you see others' people's numbers you become judged by it and there is nothing friendly about raiding in those games.

[Rita1989]

I wouldn't mind if they put in a parser that shows only your own numbers.

I know from other games that if you see others' people's numbers you become judged by it and there is nothing friendly about raiding in those games.

If your raiding there is almost always someone parsing the fight anyways so having an 100% accurate one for raiding would be nice, I wouldn't mind if they locked it out of all other content where its not needed unless its a fully premade party where everyone is fine with it.

[bardaboo]

Im on ps4. No parser, would love one. Yes. There is potential for grief, buuut that's always been there. I like improving. Been running a9s and a10s, i hate that I can't see my dps.
(Edit)i was pointing out that you don't know if you are maintaining your dps in an actual fight

[bardaboo]

@RobbieH i want a parser so I can track my own dps. It's very simple. Nothing i said went against that. At all. Stop grasping, at this point you just look pathetic.

[RobbieH]

I thought I made myself clear, that the parser would help you realize how changes to your rotation affect your DPS. Just because the numbers are 60 vs 80 doesn't mean you're not doing 33% more damage. It's a great feedback tool to tell you how you are doing as you level.

Before i start i'd like to say that so far you're the only one worth replying to, then i'd like to point out that these forums are indeed a bad place as stated in both in-game and reddit, it goes as follows:

- Someone disagrees with your ideas, gets burned alive
- People make an argument, others take it personally
- People skip arguments when they have nothing to counter them, or start going around in an attempt to dodge the argument
- People rarely read a big post, then they post one liners or whatever they can make an argument out of it leaving whatever they can't argument against behind.
- People find someone disagreeing with them and will like any post that's made against that person whether they have a point or not.

People learn by trial and error. You use logic and tooltips to think up ways to adjust your rotation and then you use feedback from a parser to determine if it made a difference.

Then can you explain me how i was taking aggro from Tanks as Monk in Binding Coil when there were no parsers (that i'm aware of)? Yes, tank aggro was buffed in a patch but i was the only one getting aggro in the static, i don't think i could possibly know if my DPS was good or not besides getting that aggro.

Considering you are advocating using logic, this is a fairly illogical conclusion. I am advocating that parsers will help the general community improve. Having the ability to improve doesn't mean that everyone is bad. That said, the vast majority of DF players do play poorly.

I never said everyone was bad, i simply said parsers won't make players much better.

How can you expect people to learn from parsers, parsers don't teach them rotations, guides or other players do.

Yeah ok, they do 1-2-3 and get 300DPS, now what?

Do you expect them to go from 1-2-3 to 15 button pressers by looking at the parser numbers?

It's not going to happen, from here they have two choices, they can go read/watch a guide and do some testing and/or they can start pressing more buttons.

The numbers might tell them that their DPS is bad, but no way they're going to become much better just with the numbers parses give them, looking at parsers advanced statistics is useless as well because those people probably don't have much clue on what they mean (yet).

I thought I made myself clear, that the parser would help you realize how changes to your rotation affect your DPS. Just because the numbers are 60 vs 80 doesn't mean you're not doing 33% more damage. It's a great feedback tool to tell you how you are doing as you level.


People learn by trial and error. You use logic and tooltips to think up ways to adjust your rotation and then you use feedback from a parser to determine if it made a difference.


Considering you are advocating using logic, this is a fairly illogical conclusion. I am advocating that parsers will help the general community improve. Having the ability to improve doesn't mean that everyone is bad. That said, the vast majority of DF players do play poorly.

This likely depends on the player, the content and their current level of skill. It's also an odd argument as the two are not mutually exclusive. I am fairly certain plenty of players who watch guides also use parsers.

Reading guides while using a parser makes sense, but expecting someone to learn a proper rotation from a parser doesn't, they will have to either do like me and a lot of people and read tooltips and follow logic, and from there test again, afterwards if they feel like they aren't doing enough for what they want they can go read a guide.

It's interesting you have this perspective, as between the two of us, you're being the jerk. In this post alone, you've insulted me by calling me dumb, saying I'm stroking my epeen and have made several other negative assumptions about me. Yet, between the two of us, you're the one advocating for no parser and I am advocating for a parser.

Well i'm sorry you read that like that, i apologize, wasn't my intention, but please don't make it look much worse than it is.

Just so you are aware, every single person who is seen doing poor DPS in games like WoW are not kicked, or even mocked. The vast majority is simply ignored.

Can't comment on that, i simply read the statement made by someone a few pages page, but that's good to know.

That is great for you. In a way you did you use a parser, the SSS, to determine your level. A parser would provide this feedback in all content. That way you could see how things change throughout. It would provide feedback as you are learning your class. It would provide your AST feedback to know who to buff - and so on.

On this i can agree, especially in Savage, and especially by looking at stats in the parser itself, such as auto attacks, uptime, crit values etc

But the thing is, people want the parser for themselves so they can see their DPS and also expect other players to become better with it, and it's here that this isn't actually true, i already explained why, but going to add on it, people get better with both parser and guides, but then the try Savage and their DPS isn't enough even for first turn, and their gear is at least enough for 3rd turn (this is just a sample scenario i'm creating), so what went wrong?

They either didn't follow the guide, didn't test SSS or dummy rotation (SSS is still better than normal Dummy because after 3m mark some Jobs can repeat their burst and thus increase their DPS).

I'm strongly in favor that people should help bad players to help them become better being with or without parser.

It kind of sounds like you think that a parser would replace SSS, video guides, written guides and so on. These are not mutually exclusive.

I don't know how you got to this conclusion and i'm sorry that you did, maybe i explained myself wrong, i simply like SSS for the reason mention above, 3m mark so people can't get a new burst to increase their numbers, obviously in a Raid scenario they can do this, not going to question that.

But that's what dummies are for, to test rotations and perfect them and gain experience from it without being interrupted, so that then people can give Savage a shot while having an idea if their DPS is enough for that specific turn.

@RobbieH i want a parser so I can track my own dps. It's very simple. Nothing i said went against that.

--insert insult here--

Yes i already got that, what you don't seem to get is that my point besides the possibility of toxicity towards bad players is that the parser alone won't make bad players good players, the parser won't teach them a rotation or remind them that they need to press more buttons.

@RobbieH

Are you worried that people will get kicked for doing low dps?
Let me ask you this, 'Have you ever kicked a player for playing poorly in DF?'

Yes it worries me that bad players get kicked in DF, DF isn't serious content, and it's a place for everyone to enjoy, thats why it exists, that's why there's no current Savage on it.

Kicking someone offline and AFK is ok, s long as that person is afk for a long period, if they had someone knocking on their door they would go for it, anyone would go for it.

It can take time, it's not their fault some random person went to knock on their door.

Can also be someone taking care of baby and the baby starts crying.

There's a LOT of something that most people don't understand it's meaning: circumstances.

Offline people:

Someone might have poor internet connection, it's not their fault their ISP is having issues or is simply a bad ISP, which might also be the only one available to them.

Then there's the issue where the game tells us we are still logged in when coming back, i guess this is also players fault?

Majority of people don't. They simply go with it and then complain about it here.

Majority? These forums is maybe frequented at most by 10% of the player base, lol.

The only time I see a player getting kicked is when they go offline, AFK for a long time or start acting salty to others in party.

On DF for the most part this is true, but not always, in DF Trials and Raids poor players still get kicked being them DPS, Healers or Tanks.

[WeekendSoja]

@RobbieH

Reading your post has really disheartened my view on this games community. While pro-parsers are advocating that a parser could potentially raise the level of players capability by allowing them to see real numbers behind a rotation they studied from a guide, in tandem also giving them confidence to pursue other things if they start to see that their numbers are lining up with above average parsers.

While you on the other hand advocate the negatives of parsing, and these negatives being at the most extreme of circumstances.

Your arguement shave become rather dull in those respects due to how you view parsers in such a negative light. In addition you actually promote poor play in your arguement...which is disgusting, performing poorly ingame can literally be taken as a reflection of ones self out of game...because normally, a person will pursue a hobby as fervently as their real life goals.

A parser is an invaluable resource for those who want to improve.