SAMURAI SHOWDOWN

[Jhett_Magnum]

What stops a WAR from MT?

What I mean is the fact that introducing 2 powerful OTs might put PLD and DRK behind.

Emphasis on might.

The ultimate goal is to make all tanks viable to raid with one another without hindering other jobs. At least that's what i would want to see.

[ADVSS]

Cyan from FF6.,,,The Samurai Eorzea needs, not the Samurai it deserves. Quadra slice anyone?

[Shippuu]

Nor I said it would hurt, but the idea that the more tank jobs, the better DF-wise has proven to be false. Everyone jumped on DRK when they released it, and almost exactly two months after, queues were the same as they always were. Does this mean they don't have to add more tank jobs? No. However, people need to stop thinking that a vast amount of tank jobs will somehow quicken the queues for everyone else; players will not play the role they don't like.

Just because it didn't have long lasting results doesn't mean it's not worth it. Also, just because one attempt didn't work doesn't mean a different attempt won't. 2 months of increased tanks is better than 2 months of decreased tanks, which is what will likely happen if only DPS jobs are added to the game. This hurts a lot especially when it's at the launch of a new expansion where you want to leave players with good impressions on the game so they'll continue to be subscribed.


A lot of players have never tried tanking and thus don't actually know if they'd like it or not. So adding popular requested jobs as tanks is a good way to get them to try and break out from their comfort zone and try something new. Plenty won't like it, but some will, and some may make the change to tanking full time (or more than they usually did).

The point is, it doesn't hurt to add more tank jobs and variety, and it has it has plenty of potential benefits. Whereas neglecting the tanking role and not adding new fresh tank jobs will certainly have a negative effect.

[shao32]

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tank or not i go to play the class and depend of the gamplay i have fun or not, im multidisciplinar player i don't stuck in a role and say this other is boring they don't deserve a samurái or drk, un this game both roles are damage dealers but diferents thinks to be focus, i don't want samurái for get more tanks population, i want it because can be the perfect second tank with high dps like warrior the perfect new OT, df don't go to change but none jobs become a waste only for be X role, thats very rude.

In fact im playing like AST in df a lot of times and normal midas to because i like so much the job and i never play so much like a healer with mi alt before the expansión, and now i enjoy it, im the person how think is you like the job the role is secundary.

[Jhett_Magnum]

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Keep in mind that each class needs to grow. Next expansion we will get skills that make more sense and DRK will feel like a Parry/dodge/anti magic tank more.

[mosaicex]

I want them to be tank, but I'm fine with either at this point. I just want them ASAP.

[Nicobo]

I dunno, I can totally see Samurai being a tank.

It's original intention in XI was a tank with it's Seigan and Third Eye ability.

The player-base turned it into the DPS only that it is now.....

SAM was made as a DD, SE did introduce SAM as a DD when it released. ^^;

[Shurrikhan]

I'm fine with either. Meaning I'd like the SAM to have the choice of either role. I just want new gameplay, in feel and/or components, really.

[Duelle]

I think we have a different opinion on what "A very distinct look" is because that is a generic knight of which we have a-plenty.

Not exactly. Armor over heavy robes tends to be a very different deal from your standard plate armor over chainmail, since it's usually for caster-oriented knights (you know, like those INT-based tanks some people have been asking for). You can still use it as a base and tweak it where needed.

You do realize the irony in saying a SAM would be an overlap and then suggest Mystic Knight and Templar, both of which are Knight archetypes of which we have 2 knight-themed tanks already.

My point is that people already got burned with DRK being turned into a tank when some expected it to be DPS. I wouldn't want to see the same done with SAM. Specially not for reasons like "every tank should deal slashing damage".

Not to mention Mystic Knight or Templar could be built around less passive defense and more effects that deal with mitigation. A write-up I did for Mystic Knight actually had them equipping THM/BLM gear for the 1-50 grind with a stance that modifies defense gained from that armor to give it equal EHP to PLD/DRK/WAR, and then going into "of Warding" gear for the post-50 game. Even if you were to not use THM/BLM gear, you could create a variant of medium armor to work off, and have the AF set be armor over a heavy robe while remaining the same stat-wise. If you want a point of reference for the aesthetic, look at warrior priests from the Warhammer mythos; they wear medium armor over a robe.

How is a 1 handed hammer any different in animations than the 1 handed sword Paladin's use?

Different swing angles and force applied. On maces, the fact you can use both "faces" of the weapon to strike. The fact that you can make some of the weapon skills magic related (remember that half of the club weapon skills in FFXI were non-physical effects).

How is a 2 Handed hammer any different in animations than the 2 Handed axe Warrior's have?

Read the above. With maces and two-headed hammers you don't have to worry about the striking side of a weapon the way you do with an axe. Use and purpose are also very different. And again, you could make the weapon skills act as spell effects.

Any argument supporting that hammers could be unique in terms of appearance/animations can also be made for Samurai and their weapons. They are distinctly different than both PLD swords and DRK swords, held differently, moved about differently etc.

Indeed. I'm not sure why you think I'd argue otherwise.

You're also acting like DPS have no slashing damage available to them, which is factually untrue i.e. Ninja.

Except knives don't do anything for me.

In fact, DPS have the most options in terms of types of damage and available styles they can play as, by a lot. (7 DPS options, as opposed to 3 tanks and 3 healers.)

Neither do lances or fists. Nevermind the design issues I have with MCH and BRD nor the fact I generally don't main casters.

Also, realistically, the type of damage is such a non-issue that it doesn't matter if everything in the game did slashing damage or whatever. People are getting uppity over the "type" of damage a job deals when it honestly doesn't matter in the slightest. There doesn't have to be any semblance of "balance" in terms of what types of damage every job does.

And yet people use the damage type and the debuffs attached as part of a class' utility. That's largely why I have a problem with it.

[MagiusNecros]

Personally I kinda want our next DPS to be Magic based. Or even a flat magic based Tank. None of this slashing/piercing damage nonsense. Most of the jobs and classes are too centered on melee classes. Tanks? All Melee at their core. DPS? Over half of them are melee and physical. How many Magic pure DPS classes we got? 2?

Melee Healer class would be great too since over there everything is magic based.

Think out of the box a little bit.