Its april 2016 yet no healer stat weights???

[Lyrica_Ashtine]

You can certainly disagree that you don't feel the need to cast faster. But personally I don't see the other stats giving better gains right now. The gains on everything but Crit is terrible. And crit mostly just bloats overhealing unless you have shields.

I'll drop the whole bias factor of it for now, as it has no obvious (numerical) gains from it aside from the idea of "oh I can cast faster" and it's not an aspect you seem willing to let go.

Crit bloats overhealing to an extend, ranging from 100% overhealing to 0%. Depending on the amount of overhealing it's still a a merit that spell speed will never be able to put on the table. That's only when looking at the healing aspect of a healing job's kit. Considering healer DPS is part of the meta - Before you no-healer-dps-cultist rage on this, I'm not stating it's a mandatory thing. As GCD and resource restrictions are applied, there are only X amount of GCDs you can squeeze out within an encounter. One part will be invested in healing. The other into DPS or idling if you're the type of healer who does not do so. And idling, by the way, wastes even more of spell speed's potential.

[Sabeta]

I'd like to point out again that I never claimed Spell Speed truly superior to Crit. As far as potency and damage goes Crit will outweigh any other stat, but I offered that Spell speed provides unique advantages crit cannot, and as such should not be discredited. Our secondary choices do not matter too much in the end, after all I've seen content solo'd with SpS/Pie builds on Scholar. Does that mean it's the best build a Scholar can have? No, it was just what that individual chose. Healing is as others have said a very binary existence. SpS can easily be the difference between pass or fail, whereas a crit is the difference between pass or pass harder.

If you want to play the numbers game, by all means feel free to chose Crit. Chances are you'll do just fine, because we healer's don't care about measuring out the absolute 1% extra HPS possible. If I played White Mage I would choose Spell Speed, but if you're content with Determination or Critical then by all means have fun with it. Unlike DPS, Healers are free to choose the stat weight that suits their style more. We aren't burdened into min-maxing every single point of HPS.

[Katlyna]

As GCD and resource restrictions are applied, there are only X amount of GCDs you can squeeze out within an encounter.

X GCDs isn't entirely static though once you factor in movement, accidents, canceled casts etc. If GCDs squeezed out were static then everyone's performance would be more similar in DPS and HPS. On the contrary if one actually compares a large set of people you'll find that small sets of people squeeze out more GCDs than others, resulting in higher throughput. Higher Spell speed slightly increases the opportunity for catching an extra GCD here and there. None the less you are right, higher spell speed likely results in more opportunities to DPS or Idle (in comparison to other stats).

I will readily admit that if raiding were entirely static, locked to a very precise set of GCDs, and no mistakes are made by anyone, then spell speed becomes moot. But technically speaking under those conditions all the other stats become moot as well, as either way you're going to clear under these conditions. Personally the interesting question for secondary stat customization isn't which are "statistically best" or highest HPS. The question should be which stats are most likely to save you when mistakes are made. And out of our stat options which is most useful for problems which typically occur while raiding throughout the week.

Functionally speaking Critical stacking nets opportunity to be randomly "saved" or buffered by critical heals at the right moments. There is no denying that a well placed critical heal is invaluable. But there is also no denying that critical heals are in-fact random. They are much more likely to overheal someone or heal health which would have been covered by a HOT, than they are to result in a clutch save. And likewise, if a critical heal was a clutch save, then technically speaking someone did something wrong. Personally in ever MMO I've played at healing, critical stats are only truly valuable when HP pools are huge and over-healing is minimal or critical heals result in over-shielding. For Astros and White mages neither of these situations is true. Consequently critical heals while nice to have, aren't an overly useful stat to invest more in (unless the gains are extremely large).

Spell speed gains on the other hand are very static. They net you very distinct but small changes in your movement, time till heals finish casting, how quickly you can finish healing a mechanic and flip to DPS, etc. Spell speed gains and play behavior changes aren't random. You know exactly what to expect and what you can do. You do have to learn to react quickly to use the extra time. But the extra time exists. Lets say over an encounter someone with not spell speed stacked casts 100 times. If you compared with someone with spell speed stacked who casts each spell 0.07 seconds faster that gives them 7 extra seconds of time to work with. That's free time to move, or cast over an encounter. That is a significant measurable difference in behavior. That is why I personally value and stack spell speed, because that extra time is extremely useful over the coarse of an encounter.

[Lyrica_Ashtine]

I'd like to point out again that I never claimed Spell Speed truly superior to Crit.

Did you now?

Spell Speed on the other hand has one extremely significant advantage over Crit.

Snip

If you'd go back a few posts back, you'd know I'm referring to the restrictions. Considering how scripted every encounter is there is a certain amount of GCDs you can squeeze out in the perfect scenario. If it's not a GCD restriction, it's a resource restriction. Either restriction impacts the benefit spell speed grants and in most cases it'll be completely void due to resource restrictions due to, for example, throwing out a raise or two. Even more so if Swiftcast is involved. Also, if you start considering factors that would interrupt casts, that would void any benefit spell speed would bring in the long run even more.

And to both of you; there are two things to consider:
First would be all the nonsense merits spell speed would provide. Simple techniques such as pre-casting completely voids any benefit spell speed brings. If you can pre-cast at 1.9s cast time, why can't you with 2.0s? If you're in a situation where the tank will die in the 0.05s time difference before the next auto attack lands, there's something more important to consider than a stat that provides no obvious advantage aside from satisfying your personal comfort zone.
Secondly, when all mechanics are done perfectly and no one dies, the number one cause for wipes are failing DPS checks. Even when things aren't done perfectly, but was recovered, not meeting DPS checks will lead to failure to complete said encounter. Meeting DPS checks is team effort. Healers happen to be in a much easier spot to contribute some extra damage in. Being in the main healer spot does not mean you automatically get your ticket out of it. Healer DPS is a combined effort; you either bust your ass in a way so the other healer can push out more damage or you work together with the other healer for a better combined result. The former being the more common iteration. Yes, spell speed brings similar DPS advantage other stats do. But this brings us back to what I mentioned before: GCD and/or resource restrictions.

So what does this mean for Determination and Crit? Determination is a flat bonus, no one's arguing with that. Crit has a chance for overhealing ranging from 100% to 0% and is subjected to RNG. But some benefit is still a benefit over something spell speed does not bring on the table. Especially if you'd consider healer DPS as you can't "overdamage" as you overheal while the encounter is still going.

And before this even becomes a trigger for the only-heal-as-a-healer cult: I'm not saying healer must contribute damage. But if your group's failing over and over by not meeting DPS checks while you're not helping with it either, don't tell those in the DPS role to "git gud" as you're not doing your best either.

[DreamWeaver]

Here's a crazy idea :

As a WHM, Spell Speed synergizes well with Crit.

As many people have stated before, healing in this game is scripted:
2 Cures here for the AA, 1 Cure II for the Tank Buster, Divine Seal Medica II for the raid damage etc etc and so on.

As we all know, Cure II is one of WHM's most MP inefficient heals, you basically pay extra MP to stay ahead of GCDs in these scripted fights, and 1 of the major things that push you to be behind in GCDs is tank busters.

Now, I would like to explore the interactions of each secondary stats (DET, SS, and Crit) with tank busters (I define tank busters as hard hitting abilities that hits so hard 1 Cure II is not enough to top up the tank).

DET:
If you're been using Cure II for tank busters previously, chances are even with a boatload of DETs, you'll still wanna use Cure II instead of Cure I. (I can't really provide an exact heal value here unfortunately as I'm not really aware on how much DET helps in increasing heal potency, but I'm kinda sure it's still not that great compared to 2.0)

SS:
With 888 SS, my GCD is at 2.3s, and my Cure cast time is at 1.84s, compared to a non SS character with (I am assuming, due to forced SS on certain equipment) 2.45s GCD, and 1.96s Cure cast time.
With that much SS, I am able to heal a target twice 0.27s (0.15+0.12) faster compared to a non SS character.

Crit:
Should I just cast Cure I instead of Cure II and pray for a crit?
If I Cure II and it crits, that's wasted overhealing.
If I Cure I and it doesn't crit, I'm behind in GCDs now.
decisions decisions.

The point I'm trying to get across is, with high SS, you are more flexible and am able to make more delicate adjustments to your healing rotations by virtue of your faster cast time.

Take the above tank buster scenario for instance:
If a player is geared for both SS and Crit, he may opt and plan to cast 2 Cure Is instead of 1 Cure II due to his faster cast time.
Now due to his high crit stat, the 1st Cure I ends up being a critical, thus he does not even need to cast the second Cure I now.

I don't think there's any other combination of secondary stats that allow for a minimal risk switch from Cure II to Cure I for tank busters:
Crit + DET : Cast may be too slow, if the 1st Cure I didn't crit, the tank may end up dying before your second cure lands.
SS + DET : No crit, best you can do is 2x Cure I.

In conclusion, I am personally going for a mixture of Crit and SS for now, due to its potential to change how we utilize our heals to be more MP efficient (Cure I for Tank Busters instead of Cure II) compared to other secondary stats, where if you're gonna cast 1 Cure II with X amount of secondary stats, you'll still cast 1 Cure I with (X+300) amount of secondary stats.

[Katlyna]

The point I'm trying to get across is, with high SS, you are more flexible and am able to make more delicate adjustments to your healing rotations by virtue of your faster cast time.

Exactly DreamWeaver. SS helps free up time for decision, movement, and adjustments.

I agree with you Lyrica, that in a perfect scenario there are a limited number of GCDs you can squeeze out and at some precise spellspeed number you would reach optimal GCDs with minimal idle/movement time, and excess spellspeed after this becomes "lost". The problem is raiding isn't a perfect world. Its highly scripted and damage is generally discrete but your team as a whole makes mistakes, takes more time for positioning sometimes, and less others. Extra spell speed helps give you extra time to perform your healing closer to "perfect" execution.

Anyway, Crit and SS both have serious merit over the other stats in my eyes (baring you have enough Piety to deal with your average issues). Between the two its very much up to personal taste. But both change your optimal playstyle slightly. Recognizing how playstyle changes should occur and reacting appropriately is the key to choosing and living with your ideal stats.

[Sabeta]

Saying that one had an advantage is not the same as saying it's the best. At this point you're reading comprehension is now in question, and I can't take you seriously anymore.

I feel that you're just being contrarian at this point.

[Jukebox12]

Everyone does know that Aoe heales as a higher chance of criting then single target heal correct. Imo i love 689-800 spell speed and 540-580 det. I don't care about my crit sometimes i overheal and sometimes the crit really helps me. As a astro i usally run dirunel and i love critting helios and aspect helios sometimes. Crit can be a overhealing or a life saver. As a whm a crit regen tick or a cure 2 or a medica2/medica crit is always nice

[Jukebox12]

White mage can sometimes love crit. I don't play alot of sch but i don't raid with it and if your a casual player crit>spell speed>det have not been missing on anything from 3.3...