Learning How To Be A Ninja

[DarkerOrange]

sigh. By all means play however you like, but please don't give other people bad advice. Dots should be put up after TA, so that they tick with the extra potency. The only time this will not be the case is if the boss is about to phase change, or disappear for a period of time.

The proven best opener is: Huton>wait 20 secs> Suiton on pull>SE>KS+IR>GS>POT>DE/AE>B4B>SE>TA>SF>Raiton>MU>DWaD>SE>Mug>GS>Dual>AE>Jug

If you aren't using pots, move B4B to after GS, and move Jug to after DE/AE.

[Malicewolf]

sigh. By all means play however you like, but please don't give other people bad advice.

By no means am I saying this is the end all only way to do this. I find i'm comfortable with this rotation and it works well for me.

^ I'm not saying mine is the only way, but I've gotten plenty of props while playing my NIN and this is how I do so. However, I will say, I did not know the tick potency ONLY increased if you apply during the vulnerability. I was under the assumption the DoT would increase with the vulnerability when it was placed, not stay stagnant prior to it's application. If what you said is the case, then yes, I would agree it would be worth it to proc a SF after TA first. But I'm still not sure if the numbers would come out to be higher than fitting in two Aeolian Edges into the rotation with the vulnerability up even with the extra tick potency, but once again, will have to test that.

I honestly forgot to put my ninjitsu after suiton into my rotation last post. I will say, I do love that there's so many side options open for NIN's to use ^^ (very unlike my PLD). Also, why would you use IR so early? You use it so early, I feel like you would lose it halfway through your TA's vulnerability? I mean, I know B4B is up, but it's OGCD, wouldn't you want to maximize it in through the vulnerability? Why wouldn't you switch B4B and IR. B4B lasts longer, IR only lasts 15 sec compared to B4B's 20. The vulnerability is only for 10 seconds. Honest curiosity here, not trying to poke holes.

[Eloah]

OMG, I just realizee he's on Siren, I am so gonna look for him now, and teach him thecways of the lala ninjas, lol.

[DarkerOrange]

It is 100% definitely better to get MU and SF up during TA, than do 2 AEs.

IR is used early because the AE used with Duality cannot crit, and when used after the first GCD, IR will drop just as you press AE, meaning the none of the duration of IR is wasted on weapon skills that cannot crit. That opener I posted is pretty much as optimal as you can get in terms of oGCD placement.

[Xenon_S]

but once again, will have to test it

Basic math
SF does 440 potency fully ticked, MU does 360 potency fully ticked, AE does 360 Potency
The standard opener after TA goes SF MU 1-2-(duality)AE
440+360+150+200+720

Doing double AE, you either do 1-2-TA-AE-1-2-DAE-MU, or 1-TA-2-DAE-1-2-AE

360+150+200+720+360 or 200+720+150+200+360
I will leave the basic addition in your hands

And dots are snapshotted, so please kindly edit your main post to avoid misinforming new players, thanks


Edit

Also, stance dance, um, hello?
If you main tank you do know that most, if not all bosses and stun resisted anyways
Only some endgame fights like savage Alexander 678 requires proper usage of stuns and silences, and that will be communicated well beforehand.

Also, healing from mug is negligible. Decently well geared at i221 it does between 1600-1700 damage, about 800point hp steal on a 90s cooldown, and it should be used asap on cooldown for dps anyways. I have over 16k hp, I'm pretty sure over 90s I auto recover more hp than what mug gives. If I need a self heal for taking raid wide damage I time a second wind for 2-3k instant heal.

[Jim_Berry]

I have my Mudras on Crossbar 8 (Hold L2 then Hold R2, or Hold R2 then Hold L2) on the face buttons (SQUARE, TRIANGLE, CIRCLE) with X being the Ninjutsu.

I have it like this so that I can run with my left thumb while still casting Mudras with my right thumb. I'm at work, and hope I remember this topic when I get home to post a screenshot; my NIN use 5 and a half hotbars.

[Darkstride]

I have my Mudras on Crossbar 8 (Hold L2 then Hold R2, or Hold R2 then Hold L2) on the face buttons (SQUARE, TRIANGLE, CIRCLE) with X being the Ninjutsu.

I have it like this so that I can run with my left thumb while still casting Mudras with my right thumb. I'm at work, and hope I remember this topic when I get home to post a screenshot; my NIN use 5 and a half hotbars.

How do you have 5 and a half hotbars filled just for Ninja? I have all of my Ninja abilities set on just Hotbar 1 & 8 (expanded). The only thing I have separate is venoms, because they don't need to be swapped frequently. I have my other functions such as Sprint, Teleport, Mounts etc on separate hotbars but those are shared between jobs.

[Jim_Berry]

How do you have 5 and a half hotbars filled just for Ninja? I have all of my Ninja abilities set on just Hotbar 1 & 8 (expanded). The only thing I have separate is venoms, because they don't need to be swapped frequently. I have my other functions such as Sprint, Teleport, Mounts etc on separate hotbars but those are shared between jobs.

Bars 1 through 4 are generally the same layout. Only difference would be R2 + Triangle, where one bar has Armor Crush, another bar had Aeolian Edge, etc. The "half" bar is for misc things I generally don't use but still want access to, such as Hide, Sneak Attack, and a few others. My dps increased when I spreaded those "combo finishers" on separate bars for some reason.

[Darkstride]

Bars 1 through 4 are generally the same layout. Only difference would be R2 + Triangle, where one bar has Armor Crush, another bar had Aeolian Edge, etc. The "half" bar is for misc things I generally don't use but still want access to, such as Hide, Sneak Attack, and a few others. My dps increased when I spreaded those "combo finishers" on separate bars for some reason.

Ahhh, I see. I just use the expanded hotbar for my combo finishers. I have Spinning, Gust, Aeolian and Armor Crush on bar 1 (R2), and then on hotbar 8 (R2 + L2) I have Shadow Fang and Dancing Edge. I'm always on bar 1 when I start any combo, then if I need SF, DE or Mutilate all I have to do is hold L2.

[Malicewolf]

Basic math
SF does 440 potency fully ticked, MU does 360 potency fully ticked, AE does 360 Potency
The standard opener after TA goes SF MU 1-2-(duality)AE
440+360+150+200+720

Doing double AE, you either do 1-2-TA-AE-1-2-DAE-MU, or 1-TA-2-DAE-1-2-AE

360+150+200+720+360 or 200+720+150+200+360
I will leave the basic addition in your hands

And dots are snapshotted, so please kindly edit your main post to avoid misinforming new players, thanks


Edit

Also, stance dance, um, hello?
If you main tank you do know that most, if not all bosses and stun resisted anyways
Only some endgame fights like savage Alexander 678 requires proper usage of stuns and silences, and that will be communicated well beforehand.

Also, healing from mug is negligible. Decently well geared at i221 it does between 1600-1700 damage, about 800point hp steal on a 90s cooldown, and it should be used asap on cooldown for dps anyways. I have over 16k hp, I'm pretty sure over 90s I auto recover more hp than what mug gives. If I need a self heal for taking raid wide damage I time a second wind for 2-3k instant heal.

eh i checked it out, yes, you are correct, it does not tick up with vulnerability, must be done after the vulnerability hits. Though, the difference is small, every bit helps, HOWEVER, I decided to do some tests to see the total dmg and i have to say, I don't agree still... here are my results (i did not upkeep DE for this, for EITHER of my testing)
Your rotation of: TA goes SF MU 1-2-(duality)AE
949 dmg for SF
317 for Mut
796 for SE
1057 for GS
1672 for DAE
1697 for AE
Total dmg for purely the rotation was 6488 dmg
The mut ticks were: 223+152+149+234+152+151+145+142+147+142 = 1637 dmg
The SF ticks were: 204+225+204+323+210+204 = 1370 dmg

Total outcome in dmg for your rotation = 9495

My rotation WITH mut and SF on BEFORE the TA of: TA-2-DAE-1-2-AE
1054 dmg for GS
1684 dmg for AE
1571 dmg for DAE
775 dmg for SE
1079 dmg for GS
1680 dmg for AE
Total dmg for purely rotation = 7843
The mut ticks were: 141+139+141+154+144+149+151+148+147+139 = 1453
The SF ticks were: 203+190+199+203+203+199 = 1197

Total outcome in dmg for my rotation = 10493

This was only 1 round of testing. But in it, I will say, your DAE produced higher than mine did. Non of these were crit hits above.

I never said do not use SF and MUT. I said apply beforehand and use the vulnerability to maximize your attack dmg in single hits (AE). Not to mention, you give yourself TWO opportunities to get a crit AE in here, which alone would be well worth the extra dmg. The chances of you getting a crit tick of SF or MUT every tick are extremely thin. And without it, it won't add up to the boost of a critical AE.

As for that last part about the healing with mug. 2000 seems negligible too when you compare it to your total hp. But it can be the difference between you standing and you on the floor. I'm not saying it'll change your life, i'm saying every bit counts, just as you are by saying use SF and Mut to get the dmg tick buff from the vuln. And more so, it's better to be careful NOT to overuse stun. VA comes to my mind quite often as I can't tell you how many times howl's have gone off because we have too many DPS spamming their stuns away for that bit of extra dmg and then we all get massive dmg because I can't stun when I need to.