How can they add more classes and make them unique and have their own flavor?

[Joe_Schmoe]

Can't really think of any that hasn't been done before, unless you want to make a bartender class, or a barber class, or a librarian class etc. but I doubt anyone would want to play those, at least not seriously. You can mix n' match class mechanics, but I'm pretty sure in this day and age we'd all go "Hey, this is a mix n' match class!" so that wouldn't help much. I'm out of ideas otherwise.

[Scorcher24]

Can't really think of any that hasn't been done before, unless you want to make a bartender class, or a barber class, or a librarian class etc. but I doubt anyone would want to play those, at least not seriously. You can mix n' match class mechanics, but I'm pretty sure in this day and age we'd all go "Hey, this is a mix n' match class!" so that wouldn't help much. I'm out of ideas otherwise.

I played a dancer in SWG. Was tons of fun. This game has barely any buffs anyway, so give me that . I'd stand in an inn to buff people all day.

[Sandpark]

They have done it in FFXI with 22 jobs and have many more jobs to choose from in the FF universe. The question isn't can they make them diverse.
It is do they want to or is there a reason to?

Questions to ask yourself:

Why are multiple roles tied to one job needed?
A)Less unique defined job choices created.
B)Loose group based rules in open world content.
C)Loose group based rules in instanced content.
D)The possibility of one job being different from another player playing the same job.


Elaborations:
A)Do you think unique story will be created for seperate builds like heal, dps, or tank? Will it be as unique as starting a brand new job with an original background?
B)Most things are instanced and have strict group requirements for duty finder. WHat if dps entered duty finder with healing skills rather than dps boost.Is a DPS paladin hybrid really going to be better than a full DPS monk?
C)Is there a ton of open world party/solo based(not public)content in FFXIV where individual/multiple roles are needed on one character? There is little open world content besides fates,hunts, and diadem, monsters hp reset hp if you make them stray from preferred zones,monsters resist many things, jobs have long cooldowns when switching jobs to prevent OP, jobs are penalized for too much movement with skills.
D)What is more unique, one job being different from another player playing the same job or one job being different from players on other jobs.

My thoughts on making combat and future jobs/classes better:
1.Remove the GCD and have mp/tp/individual cooldowns be the resource.That makes the game more dynamic and flexible versus worrying about watching spinning circles rather than action on screen.
2.Introduce more classes and remove class cooldown on open world content so people might actually use them more outside duty finder or perhaps use in future solo/duo dungeons.
3.Remove class restrictions when playing a class. In other words, let classes mix and match from different classes as we see fit. Just make their base skills/traits the most potent.
4.Allow jobs to use class skills from any class they want but keep them limited to how many available at one time and this only applies to open world content not duty finder instances. This allows more flexibility and builds for jobs as it did in ffxi.
5.A deeper gambit system for pets and companions similar to FFXII so we can custom tuned how we want our companions/pets to react.
6.Bring back the path companion system so we can have companions more inline with what an offline FF entails. Characters with stories like Auron, we can bond with them.
7.Eliminate the invisible walls. If I can't jump in it, over it, or go under it don't even render it unless it is a background in the far distance.
8.Rework the materia system to enhance certain skills and not just attributes. And don't lock the materia to gear once melded, perhaps a book similar to a glamour book that let's us swap and use sets outside battle.
9.Rework guildleves to be a springboard to unique instanced contents like hamlet, besieged, BCNM,the possibilities are endless. When you activate a card you are instantly teleported to a content with other players inhabiting it, from there a player could choose to group or solo. Of course the type of content will have some limit to how many players can enter at once.
10.Please introduce some intelligent open world systems in the future.

Thank you.

[Shurrikhan]

B)Most things are instanced and have strict group requirements for duty finder. WHat if dps entered duty finder with healing skills rather than dps boost.Is a DPS paladin hybrid really going to be better than a full DPS monk?

My thoughts on making combat and future jobs/classes better:
1.Remove the GCD and have mp/tp/individual cooldowns be the resource.That makes the game more dynamic and flexible versus worrying about watching spinning circles rather than action on screen.
2.Introduce more classes and remove class cooldown on open world content so people might actually use them more outside duty finder or perhaps use in future solo/duo dungeons.
3.Remove class restrictions when playing a class. In other words, let classes mix and match from different classes as we see fit. Just make their base skills/traits the most potent.
4.Allow jobs to use class skills from any class they want but keep them limited to how many available at one time and this only applies to open world content not duty finder instances. This allows more flexibility and builds for jobs as it did in ffxi.
5.A deeper gambit system for pets and companions similar to FFXII so we can custom tuned how we want our companions/pets to react.
6.Bring back the path companion system so we can have companions more inline with what an offline FF entails. Characters with stories like Auron, we can bond with them.
7.Eliminate the invisible walls. If I can't jump in it, over it, or go under it don't even render it unless it is a background in the far distance.
8.Rework the materia system to enhance certain skills and not just attributes. And don't lock the materia to gear once melded, perhaps a book similar to a glamour book that let's us swap and use sets outside battle.
9.Rework guildleves to be a springboard to unique instanced contents like hamlet, besieged, BCNM,the possibilities are endless. When you activate a card you are instantly teleported to a content with other players inhabiting it, from there a player could choose to group or solo. Of course the type of content will have some limit to how many players can enter at once.
10.Please introduce some intelligent open world systems in the future.

A) WoW has no problems with this. Nor Rift. Nor just about any game that allows multiple roles on one class/job. All it would take is that you have a certain amount of role-specific abilities/talents and gear, and/or have proven yourself via a SSS/Proving Grounds within that gear. (Assuming we ever do get training trials that test more than just dps.) It can also attempt to create a particularly 'bases covered party'; let's say your character has 3/5 DPS, 2/5 tanking, 4/5 healing, while another has 3/5 dps, 0/5 tanking, 5/5 healing--similarly to how a PVP forms teams based on average PvP level/rating, it could solve to cover particular needs, ensuring each role is covered according to whatever calculations work. Better than that, though, would just be to have certain multi-server PFs, or the ability to queue as multiple jobs/sets. "Looking for hybrid speedrun party. Know how to do... literally everything. Know how to mesh."

1. Just gotta say, the GCD doesn't have to be removed in order to have a less bar-fixated, more broad-(battleground)viewing or almost cinematographic perspective. It's also what holds onto any sense of intensity for fairly veteran players (see dps on dps checks, or undergeared healers in those few fights that really have or had no dps time.) Also, what would you replace this with, if anything? ATB? Stamina? How would that affect rotations? Or are rotations to be scrapped to?
2. I don't think the lack of cooldowns would be enough reason to use a class at this point. I'd love to see them empowered, but at best I feel like this would just be used to cycle through those CDs not oddly shared (like that former 7-minute cooldown on Lustrate after using Hallowed Ground, or on Perfect Balance after Elusive Jump) for gimmick gains. The community as a whole is also somehow convinced that the very idea of classes is diabolical, rather than just being a victim of half-hearted and uninventive implementation.
3. If native going to always be the most potent, and especially if the GCD is no longer a factor as to create those few opportunities for filler dps between native (de)buffs, the cross-class abilities aren't even going to be used as much as they are now. Not without massive revision, at least.
4. Do we really want a Dragoon using Demolish, Rockbreaker, etc.? Don't get me wrong, I liked the opportunities I had before 1.18 to craft my own arsenal, especially if that had been directly improved on, but...
5. Would definitely go for some better and adjustable pet AI, yes.
6. Fair enough, though I'd like to also see them mesh well enough with playing with other actual players.
7. I'm tempted to agree with you here, but that means even fewer details in already kind of dull maps. I'd be right behind this if it actually meant that they'd go for verticality and whatnot instead of leaving unaccessible holes, but I expect it'd be more a case of just making things relatively plateaued from then on. Ehh, if assuming the best, I'd want the same.
9. So, something almost as cool as the cutscene in which we originally see guildleves?...
10. Like what? Something that requires intelligence, rather than being a zerg, or something that can more intelligently handle varying player loads/contributions?

[Synrin]

WoW has no problems with this.

Not sure what you two are talking about, but atm WoW has loads of issues with class identity. They might fit everything in this amazing story and give you amazing abilities, but for example healers, especially now in Legion will be all the same. Same mechanics, same abilities.....

[RiceisNice]

Not sure what you two are talking about, but atm WoW has loads of issues with class identity. They might fit everything in this amazing story and give you amazing abilities, but for example healers, especially now in Legion will be all the same. Same mechanics, same abilities.....

I agree with this. During cata/MoP there was very little difference between the gameplay and aesthetics of a marksman and survival hunter. Both used a ranged weapon, both shot things and things died. Legion is doing an entire overhaul of that though where marksmanshot foregoes the pet aspect (being exclusive to survival and beastmastery now) and survival being a melee trapper. Can't speak on healers and tanks though, but the class idenity has mostly been an issue for classes that had multiple dps roles (arms and fury warriors for example)

Fire monsters weak against water/ice, absorbs fire attacks, ice monsters weak against fire, absorbs ice attacks, hard scaled monsters impervious against slash attacks, flying monsters weak against shoot attacks, etc.

The first time when I played this game, I was surprised that elemental/attack properties was missing, because in my opinion THAT is really what makes every class/job, and frankly, the entire game unique. Without it, there is really no point in which class/job you choose, because every kind of attack will always result in the same outcome.

Then you're going to run into problems where you (don't) want X jobs because of those elemental attacks. And not to sound rude, but I don't think you've played BLM very much if you think that fire, blizzard and thunder spells result in the same outcome, or any other job for that matter because they'd have other abilities that add onto their playstyle (such as BotD, ninjitsu and MNK stacks)

[Kaurie]

Not sure what you two are talking about, but atm WoW has loads of issues with class identity. They might fit everything in this amazing story and give you amazing abilities, but for example healers, especially now in Legion will be all the same. Same mechanics, same abilities.....

Hmm, I don't have many hours in WoW, but I felt that my Holy Priest was very different from my Resto shaman (way more so than WHM vs SCH, where WHM vs SCH was more like Holy Priest vs Disc Priest iirc)

Because of the way they've structured the game, it would require taking some risks to add classes that would truly feel different or offer "game changing" elements.

Given their track record so far, I doubt they will do so. Classes will likely remain a visual wrapper to similar functioning skills with one or two unique uses.

In my opinion, it is a far greater risk to keep things similar. The game will rapidly become more boring if things are not appropriately spiced up. I think it would be better for the health of the game to add a DPS that everyone wants and rolls/levels up etc (NIN for example), than it would be to add a DPS that few people like and is basically a carbon copy of [x] job (MCH for example). Keeping things interesting is what is going to keep people playing long term. Keeping with the status quo is what is going to have people leaving for the next big thing.

[RiceisNice]

In my opinion, it is a far greater risk to keep things similar. The game will rapidly become more boring if things are not appropriately spiced up. I think it would be better for the health of the game to add a DPS that everyone wants and rolls/levels up etc (NIN for example), than it would be to add a DPS that few people like and is basically a carbon copy of [x] job (MCH for example). Keeping things interesting is what is going to keep people playing long term. Keeping with the status quo is what is going to have people leaving for the next big thing.

I feel like this is definitely the case for MCH/BRD. The two share the same role and purpose, but it's also down to the abilties and flow of gameplay. Instead of sticking with a multiple attachment/stance they had originally wanted for MCH, they scrapped it and only gave one attachment (gauss barrel). ...then turned around and gave BRD a duplicate of said "attachment", and they've done away with having a traditional physical ranged dps. Balance (espesically numbers) sohuldn't be a huge concern when it comes to things like that, you could just tune it with mid patches or hotfixes. It's job mechanics that takes a lot more time to adjust, if not change.

Because of the way they've structured the game, it would require taking some risks to add classes that would truly feel different or offer "game changing" elements.

Given their track record so far, I doubt they will do so. Classes will likely remain a visual wrapper to similar functioning skills with one or two unique uses.

If you're to compare DRG and MNK on release, the two have entirely different GCDs when monk is at GL3. DRG in 3.0 also revolves around mixing in their oGCD (due to animation lock from jumps) and effectively managing their BoTD timer through GS. MNK has no such burdens, but instead need to maintain full uptime on the boss and minimize damage loss from downtime. NIN also approaches differently without the burden of having to maintain uptime, but instead 2 different timers/dots that branch off their weaponskill versus the highest damaging combo, on top of ninjitsu.

Same with BLM/SMN, the two function so differently in their resources that it's just not a comparable gameplay. Likewise with the healer's approach to healing and the utility behind it. The only time I feel they truly dropped the ball on job identity is BRD/MCH, and SCH/SMN if we're speaking specifically on dpsing (which honestly might as well be the case in your average dungeon runs).