Please Add no bonus option for PF

[Eidolon]

Oh I understand the purpose just fine, thanks.

I just happen to think this is more of a matter of "check yourself" rather than anything SE should (or likely will) act upon. Because really, why would SE implement a feature that would just make it even harder for its playerbase to attempt the content that they create? It's not like the content has a terribly long lifespan as it is in a game like this, you know.

Fun fact:
adding the ability to filter members from party finder does not affect a player's access to the content. They are still able to create a PF, join a PF (That they *ARE* eligible for) as well as create their own PF and enter via DF. The simple fact that you believe this creates a barrier to entry (That does not already exist) simply shows just how little about the suggestion you understand.


This content will have a 3month lifespan. The weapons will be relevant for off-classes, and people will continue to practice, farm, etc. it leading up to the next major patch. 3 Month isn't too bad in terms of this game - it's about half the raid cycle (Likely this content will be outdated by the next EX-primal + catchup content, but people will still run it even after that.)

[Archaell]

I support the option, yet with the amount of carrying I am afraid it is not good enough.

Imo the bonus should state who the new player is - this alone would scare a lot of players from cheating the system.

The bonus should stay for multiple clears. Let's say a random number like 5 - to keep the players in the learning parties longer.

And the farm option should not be unlocked until about 10 clears are achieved etc. and until the player beats the SSS dummy with the job he wants to get in.

The issue right now isn't just the bonus itself but also how easy it is to remove it with carrying.

[Cold_Raven]

This option is a waste of time.

Yes, it's possible for a newcomer to not know the fight and screw up.
But even with this option it's still possible for a carried-clearer to enter and screw up your fight anyway (and they are more prevalent, if you've ever done these fights before.)

The amount of anguish this option would solve is insignificant.

The solution to this problem (grouping with unknowns without knowing their skill level), is for the starter of the PF to form a static.

That's what statics are for.

This option is not what PF is for.

Yes, you are allowed to have a goal of clearing content with similarly skilled people and ignore everyone else on the server.

But the only reasonable path to that goal is a static. Every other suggestion like this does not make that path easier, it makes it harder (you're meeting less new people who could be a great addition to your static).

It's a waste of development time.

[Andrea]

Yes, it's possible for a newcomer to not know the fight and screw up.
But even with this option it's still possible for a carried-clearer to enter and screw up your fight anyway (and they are more prevalent, if you've ever done these fights before.)

Are you saying that because the solution can't fix all problems its not worth putting in?

[Cold_Raven]

Are you saying that because the solution can't fix all problems its not worth putting in?

No.
I'm saying that an solution that doesn't make a significant impact and also causing detrimental side-effects is not worth putting in.

Dishonest carried-people will still get in.
People who are better than you will be blocked.

It's a bad solution.

[Singularity]

I would also point out that the amount of development time involved is likely to be small. Obviously I don't know the game's codebase, nor even what language it's written in, but it's simply a matter of combining two simple operations that must both (based on other things the game already does) already exist.

[Cold_Raven]

I would also point out that the amount of development time involved is likely to be small. Obviously I don't know the game's codebase, nor even what language it's written in, but it's simply a matter of combining two simple operations that must both (based on other things the game already does) already exist.

You are correct.

But just because something is quick to do, doesn't mean it's not a waste of time to implement.
We have to consider what the problem is, and figure out a solution to correct the problem.

If you just want to implement any idea that can be done quickly... you'll end up with a horrible, useless game.

This idea isn't a waste of time because it would take a long time.
It's a waste of time because the offered solution just doesn't make any significant impact to the problem.

[Singularity]

people who got a carry-clear (many, many people, more than will be blocked by not having a bonus) will still be able to be dishonest about their ability to down content and still get into your PF

I dispute this statistic. It states, in effect, that among players willing to join a PF farm group without being capable of farming, more of them have the clear than don't. I find that somewhat unlikely.

It's a waste of time because the offered solution just doesn't make any significant impact to the problem.

I dispute this assertion as well. I would expect that, among candidate players for a farm group, the majority of those capable of farming have the clear, whereas the majority of those incapable do not have the clear. The suggested option filters out the majority of those incapable while allowing the majority of those capable to join. Therefore it makes assembling an effective farm group out of random players more likely.

I would also say that, by closing one of the avenues by which undeserved clears may be obtained, the system reduces the number of players able to circumvent it. Hence it makes itself more effective.

[Cold_Raven]

I dispute statistic, assertions...

The context you're using to dispute the points is valid. But I don't think it's a fair representation of the issue.

I agree with what you say about the majority of users on the whole.

But what we're talking is an issue that stems from people being dishonest about their abilities and sneaking into PFs without heeding the descriptions.

It's my contention that the number of people who do this are already a small minority of the whole population.

Like this:

Some PFs exist without issue.
Some PFs have a dishonesty-problem.
Of the PFs that have a dishonesty-problem, it's usually only 1 dink who's trying to sneak in.

Do you dispute this data?

This data would suggest that the number of dishonest people trying to sneak into PFs is about 10% of the population. (1 in 8 is 12.5 %)

The majority points you use to disregard my statements doesn't seem to take this into account.

What you need to do is look at the people who are dishonest (10% or so of the population) and then see how many of those would be prevented from entering a no-bonus PF. Keep in mind, that a dishonest person can still get an eventual clear and still be dishonest and join your no-bonus blocked PF eventually anyway. Since even a lucky clear is "inevitable" this no-bonus PF block mathematically does nothing except delay the issue by a few days until the dishonest person can get a clear and sneak in anyway.

It's a waste of time.

[RiceisNice]

@raven. Don't change the premise of the topic (what the problem is). It's not that people can't clear the content because people can't do it; the problem is that people are being dishonest about having a clear and balantly ignoring pf descriptions. People that can't clear regardless of achievements will always be a thing, but that's not what the change is for