SE please reconsider dev time spent on player vs player

[Colorful]

I wish more game dev had the balls to do something like this instead of trying to please every single player group in their game. Not saying pvp should be discarded here, as i haven't played it yet so i don't know how big of a community it is, but i feel games tend to fail more often when they try to please everyone instead of focusing on what they're good at.

If FFXIV developers catered to the "majority", there would be no endgame raids, there would be no extreme primals, there would be no Gold Saucer, there would be no, high end crafting, there wouldn't be an endless amount of pets, and so on. PvP has had a very small amount of development time allocated to it, as have some of the features I've mentioned. Should we follow in their footsteps and remove all of that, to satiate one kind of player? Why should SE focus on 2% of raiders when they could focus on the 50%+ who enjoy the MSQ? That kind of thinking is silly. FFXIV would not be as successful as it is today if it only appealed to one kind of player, period.

Now, I know you said it shouldn't be removed, but FFXIV isn't failing. It's the only MMO that has maintained a subscription for so long in recent time, it's clearly doing something right. What MMORPGs have failed the subscription model in recent times? The ones that focus on one subset of players while ignoring the rest, Wildstar and its "hardcore" appeal, SWTOR and its story focus, WoW is losing subscribers as there's nothing to do apart from raids, and even then they rarely release raids. I don't know why people are harsh towards PvP when it barely gets any focus at all. I dislike Hildibrand as much as one can dislike Hildibrand, and while I do think the efforts spent on animating those cutscenes could be better spent properly animating the MSQ I'm not going to request its removal, I don't enjoy crafting but I'm not going to request they stop focusing on that especially when a rather small amount of people are actually high end crafters. I'm not going to complain about Savage raids, the resources spent in developing mechanics for those Savage raids could easily amount to 2-3 extra floors, but I'n not going to request its removal even though it's an even smaller set of players.

Play what you enjoy and move on.

[whythehate]

I expected an OP from any EU server, and was surprised to see Balmung. PvP is a real thing on NA and JP servers. It's only deserted on EU servers

Lol wot

EU pvp is very much alive.

[Mael-bess]

If FFXIV developers catered to the "majority", there would be no endgame raids, there would be no extreme primals, there would be no Gold Saucer, there would be no, high end crafting, there wouldn't be an endless amount of pets, and so on. PvP has had a very small amount of development time allocated to it, as have some of the features I've mentioned. Should we follow in their footsteps and remove all of that, to satiate one kind of player? Why should SE focus on 2% of raiders when they could focus on the 50%+ who enjoy the MSQ? That kind of thinking is silly. FFXIV would not be as successful as it is today if it only appealed to one kind of player, period.

Now, I know you said it shouldn't be removed, but FFXIV isn't failing. It's the only MMO that has maintained a subscription for so long in recent time, it's clearly doing something right. What MMORPGs have failed the subscription model in recent times? The ones that focus on one subset of players while ignoring the rest, Wildstar and its "hardcore" appeal, SWTOR and its story focus, WoW is losing subscribers as there's nothing to do apart from raids, and even then they rarely release raids. I don't know why people are harsh towards PvP when it barely gets any focus at all. I dislike Hildibrand as much as one can dislike Hildibrand, and while I do think the efforts spent on animating those cutscenes could be better spent properly animating the MSQ I'm not going to request its removal, I don't enjoy crafting but I'm not going to request they stop focusing on that especially when a rather small amount of people are actually high end crafters. I'm not going to complain about Savage raids, the resources spent in developing mechanics for those Savage raids could easily amount to 2-3 extra floors, but I'n not going to request its removal even though it's an even smaller set of players.

Play what you enjoy and move on.

Uff, i'm not saying dev should focus on only one thing, i said they shouldn't focus on everything, i didn't even said anything needs to be done about FFXIV, it was just a random post about some game devs mentality about their games. And for gods no, FFXIV isn't failling (at least in my eyes, i'm here for 2 months and loving it).

Speaking of subscription games that failed it really depends on what you call a failure, ESO/SWTOR/LOTRO were initially but now are f2p, i can at least think of one i pre-ordered that had subscription model then went f2p then servers shutdown (Tabula Rasa), mmorpg's come and go and their reasons vary greatly, their focus on only 1 thing may be at fault i'll give you that but there's many other issues behind it i can assure you.
It's funny you mention SWTOR btw, since i came from it and their strong point was the story, which i enjoyed, the problem wasn't they decided to focus only on it, the problem was they didn't do it properly, with content patches adding only around 30 mins of new gameplay (story) to it and filled with bugs (among many other things)

Anyway i'm not saying to ignore pvp here, all i'm saying is don't try to put anything and everything in the game, sure variety is quite nice and welcome but if it doesn't complement the game and blend with it in any way and it's there just because the devs felt like it, it will become useless and nobody will end doing it (Lord of Vermilion i'm looking at you).

[RocheKat]

I don't care for PvP (in mmos)and have been a hardcore raider in many MMOs... yet I have spent way more time doing pvp in FFXIV than I have doing hardcore (savage) raids. PvP content is super easy to produce with very little resources. Its not like WoW where large amounts of effort are spent trying to balance classes and completely screwing up PvP and PvE content in the process.

Oh and I think Hildibrand is dumb and a giant waste of my time. I don't expect SE to stop doing that junk just because I don't like it. Lots of other people enjoy the content so the problem is mine.

EDIT: I cannot stress enough how little they have put into PvP. PvP in FFXIV is just like every other minigame. You can do it if you want and it has no effect on anything outside of that minigame.

I have no numbers but based on my experience in MMOs over the last 14 years (and now I am sad) I am absolutely certain that FAR more people do PvP than do Savage raids/extremes when they are current. I gave up on real raiding in FFXIV back in 2.1 when I realized the only real challenge of it was finding 7 other people competent enough to do it.

[Colorful]

Uff, i'm not saying dev should focus on only one thing, i said they shouldn't focus on everything, i didn't even said anything needs to be done about FFXIV, it was just a random post about some game devs mentality about their games. And for gods no, FFXIV isn't failling (at least in my eyes, i'm here for 2 months and loving it).

Speaking of subscription games that failed it really depends on what you call a failure, ESO/SWTOR/LOTRO were initially but now are f2p, i can at least think of one i pre-ordered that had subscription model then went f2p then servers shutdown (Tabula Rasa), mmorpg's come and go and their reasons vary greatly, their focus on only 1 thing may be at fault i'll give you that but there's many other issues behind it i can assure you.
It's funny you mention SWTOR btw, since i came from it and their strong point was the story, which i enjoyed, the problem wasn't they decided to focus only on it, the problem was they didn't do it properly, with content patches adding only around 30 mins of new gameplay (story) to it and filled with bugs (among many other things)

Anyway i'm not saying to ignore pvp here, all i'm saying is don't try to put anything and everything in the game, sure variety is quite nice and welcome but if it doesn't complement the game and blend with it in any way and it's there just because the devs felt like it, it will become useless and nobody will end doing it (Lord of Vermilion i'm looking at you).

I can't fault Bioware for their lack of story updates, they put out some of the highest quality unlike other MMORPGs (including FFXIV). That's the problem though, the MMORPG genre isn't suited to story oriented games and it certainly shows with how long that content takes to develop and the lack of proper replayability. They would have been better off creating an episodic KOTOR or the like.

Anyhow, I don't think it's an issue of useless content, it's an issue of the developers either not knowing what we want due to miscommunication from our community team, or the usual MMO developer attitude of "We know what's best for you, we know what you want better than you do". Let's take your example, very little people asked for Lords of Verminion to be a simplified StarCraft that's still rather complex in its own right, people wanted pet battles similar to what you find in Pokemon in a similar way WoW adapted them. Something you can do on the side as a minigame while in queue or just bored, not something you queue for on your own. I can guarantee you that if it had been implemented like that, it would not have only been much more successful but taken far less resources to develop (at least for a small subset of pets off the bat). They hear what we want through filters of sorts, and that's the only reason we get content that's DoA. The eternal bonding system was much requested, and it could be considered the largest waste of development time, but I believe it's a beneficial change as it enhances the social environment and gives a little something to roleplayers.

As for the OP, I feel like the got most of the Feast down perfectly but there's zero reason to keep doing it and as such I fear it'll die out. If you're not in the top 100 in your FC what is there to get out of it? Some of the ugliest gear to be designed in FFXIV (the ilvl 205 sets). Hell even if you're in the top 100 there's nothing but a helmet for you unless you're in the top 10 also, with every addition they mess something up with results in its eventual death (GC restrictions with Frontlines). PvP isn't something unwanted, SE just fails to cater to it properly time and time again and it would be rather effortless to do so. Bring up the The Fold to level 60 and have it share rankings with The Feast (have a daily roulette for them together perhaps), bring up the other Frontlines maps to level 60, all they have to do is increase the health of the things that spawn, people like variety, but when there's only one game mode there is no variety.

[Spawnie]

feast is just ._. you dont know what kinda of group your gonna get in solo queues.... most of the runs ive had they have had no organisation or team work... thnks SE for killing frontlines for this crap fest guess my hopes of ever gettin the frontlines mounts have gone down the toilet nows = =

[Kuwagami]

Lol wot

EU pvp is very much alive.

When I compare the instant-5 mins queues that I had on balmung and the 20-60 mins queues now on cerberus (maelstrom).... well no. PvP in EU is pretty much dead. You're happy with 2 or 3 games a day.

Of course 3.21 with fenrir pup and new mode will sorta prove me wrong now, but before patch it was just a "do it once for tomes maybe and done" thing

[Pomelo]

SE please reconsider the development time spent on Savage raids. I understand that you're trying to attract the hardcore types of players from WoW and other raiding MMORPGs, but you have to realize that this is FFXIV and we're mostly casuals, the queue times for this content doesn't even exist because it can't be done with a group of randoms. The resources and development time for such a tiny-tiny minority (2-3%) imo is not a wise use of your time and it shows...

Yeah, no. Development time spent on PvP is already incredibly minimal, no balance changes or anything apart from a few maps with 3 gamemodes few months for what, since 2.1? This is coming from someone who doesn't even PvP often (like once a month at that), but I'm enjoying The Feast more than quite a bit.

Actually love this post <3

[Cherub]

Remember when they showed off a mount video that was about 10 mins long and said mount was a black bike (Cloud Strife's bike). Yea, THAT was a waste of resource cuz it's not even gonna be implemented.... Though I sure would love that more than the gloria airship....