If You Were A Class/Job Designer...

[SpookyGhost]

World first a7s clear done thanks to mantra and dragon kick utility.

Which arguably wasn't necessary (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oJvp...ature=youtu.be , https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8ul2QffhnXg) though in a fight with a lenient enrage there's no reason for the world first group not to use the best survival comp (PLD + MNK).

[JackFross]

I'm gonna largely ignore the stuff written here since a lot of it is long and drawn out when none of the Jobs besides Paladin need a major overhaul.

Dark Knight

This Job is nearly perfect as it is. The only adjustments I would personally suggest are:

1. Dark Dance - Dark Arts+Dark Dance should increase the Parry rate from 30% to something more like 60-70%, instead of increasing dodge chance.

2. Dark Passenger - Dark Arts+Dark Passenger should deal 250 potency and inflict damage reduction - effect identical to and cannot stack with Storm's Path.

3. Sole Survivor - Should tack on an additional 20% TP regeneration at the same time as the Health and Mana.

4. Delirium and Souleater - each of these should cost MP to cast, not TP. Keep them exactly as they are, just costing MP instead. Some negligible 1/8 SS MP cost or so, like ~100 MP each. It wouldn't change much as far as resources go, but would drastically stem TP problems.

5. Grit - take it off the gcd, give it a 15s recast, hike up the MP cost to be the same as Dark Arts.

6. Scourge - make a Dark Arts + Scourge that turns it from a damage-over-time skill into a TP regeneration spell - 30s duration, recovering 30-40 TP per tick.

7. Power Slash - "Increased Enmity" is an added effect while in Grit.


Warrior

Too good as-is. No reason to change it, imo, aside from:

1. Butcher's Block - "Increased Enmity" is an added effect while in Defiance.


Paladin

Drastic overhaul to stances and how they work. This is the fundamental problem with Paladin and needs to be addressed in a serious, meaningful way to actually enhance the way the class is played.

Shield Oath - same as-is - 20% mitigation, 15% less damage, increased enmity.
Sword Oath - block rate becomes 0%. 10% increased attack speed.
Take both off the gcd, buff the MP cost to 2x what it is currently, with a 15s recast.

Then comes the major overhauls.

Basic, overall changes:
1. Royal Authority - Inflict slashing debuff, identical to (and overwrites/is overwritten by) Dancing Edge and Storm's Eye - I also would suggest increasing the duration of all of these skills to 24s. Potency: 320
2. Clemency - Keep the 2s cast, on the gcd. Does not interrupt combos. Cannot be interrupted while casting. Same MP cost.
3. Divine Veil - AoE party mitigation spell that shields all party members for 10% of your maximum health.
4. Cover - 15y range - Dash to ally's side and take all incoming physical damage for them, while you remain within 5y of the target for 12s. Effect wears off if you leave the range.

Renaming:
1. Shield Swipe - [Quick Strike]

[[ Shield Oath ]]
1. Rage of Halone - Inflict Strength-down debuff. Increased enmity (5.5 multiplier). Potency: 290.
2. Quick Strike - 150 potency, 15s cooldown. Blocks reset the timer - does not require a block to use it. Each use regenerates 30 TP.
3. Shield Bash - 80 TP - 110 potency - inflict stun for 6s, stay on the gcd.
4. Sheltron - 60s cooldown, auto-block next attack. Successful block recovers [RB] MP in addition to 70 TP.
5. Bulwark - reduce cooldown to 120s. Increases block rate by 60% for 20s.
6. Fight or Flight - 90s cooldown. 30s duration. Increases physical damage dealt by 20%. Increases block strength by 10%.
7. Shield Lob - same as current effect.

[[ Sword Oath ]]
1. Rage of Halone - Inflicts Strength-down debuff. Potency: 350.
2. Quick Strike - 170 potency, 15s cooldown. Each use regenerates 50 TP.
3. Shield Bash - unusable.
4. Sheltron - 60s cooldown. Causes next weaponskill to strike for critical damage.
5. Bulwark - 120s cooldown. Increases attack speed by 10% for 20s.
6. Fight or Flight - 90s cooldown. 30s duration. Increase p-damage dealt by 30%. Increase critical hit rate by 10%.
7. Shield Lob - unusable.

Ideas, not actual serious numbers. I think this buffs PLD a bit too much, but the idea behind it is what I think is important. Sword and Shield Oath need to play differently, imo. That's what Paladin is lacking.

[Syzygian]

DRK stuff

Mostly agree, save for the TP thing. As of 3.2 we actually have really good TP sustain. Not infinite mind you, but on par with a lot of melee DPS.

[JackFross]

Mostly agree, save for the TP thing. As of 3.2 we actually have really good TP sustain. Not infinite mind you, but on par with a lot of melee DPS.

I wouldn't say hitting 0 TP in ~3:30 is anywhere close to a Melee DPS TP sustain, honestly.

[Syzygian]

I wouldn't say hitting 0 TP in ~3:30 is anywhere close to a Melee DPS TP sustain, honestly.

3:30? Did we time travel back to 3.0? I take ~6:30 to TP floor on dummies.

Even if you never drop Grit or use BW, it still takes more like ~4:30 now to TP floor with the reduced costs this patch.

EDIT: double-checked my math. 6.5min to TP floor as OT, 4.2min to TP floor as MT (with no stance dancing), assuming a 2.40s GCD.

iirc, 6.5 min is roughly the time in which a DRG TP floors. So there's that.

[JackFross]

Oh? O: I'll have to go check it out later, then! What little I've run on my DRK since 3.2 it didn't really feel much different. I haven't given it a nice extended go of it, though. I trust you, I just have a hard time believing that what looks to be a minor change would actually be so major. xD

[Jhett_Magnum]

DRK:
Dark Dance increases parry rate and strength.

Dark Arts uses HP and changes to using MP with Grit activated.

Darkside increases potencies across the board with less health you have.

WAR:
It's perfect and well designed.

PLD:
Slashing debuff.

Shelltron restores TP

Tempered Will increases Determination

[Deceptus]

Haha, yeah I'll bite.

Remarkably little actually. The most infuriating thing about tank balance is how little they'd have to do to fix it.

This factors in 3.2 changes -

This plus give each tank their own provoke so they don't all have to cross class Gladiatior. Healers don't have to CC for Rez. Increase Tomahawk/Shield Lob/DRK's to the same range as provoke.

[SoloNightlock]

What skyzgian said... Though i'm not sure pld needs tp regen from sheltron and tempered will. Maybe one or the other? Or make one regen in sword oath and the other in shield oath.

[Sousoulsu]

PLD:
New mechanic: Zeal
-Zeal is generated when you finish a combo (Rage of Halone; Goring Blade; Royal Authority
-Zeal is expended based on the ability used. 1, 2, or 3 Zeal can be expended.
-Zeal stacks to a maximum of 5.

Zeal expenders:
-Sheltron costs 1 Zeal, and is changed to block all physical attacks for the next 6 seconds; and incurs a cooldown of 30s.
-Clemency costs 2 Zeal and is instant-cast; and heals for 25% more.
-Divine Veil costs 3 Zeal, and the amount shrouded is increased by 25%; and incurs a cooldown of 60s.
-Divine Reckoning(New) costs 3 Zeal, and is a high-potency single-target hit; also regenerates 100 TP.. No cooldown; can only be used in Sword Oath.

Other adjustmeownts
-Clemency costs about 1/3rd your MP; Divine Veil costs about 2/3rds; effectively making PLD MP a 3-charge system. [Add visual breakpoints to PLD MP bar to denote this].

-Shield Swipe Pacifies the main target; and cleaves all surrounding targets at 100 potency.

Reasoning
PLD should be solidified in its position as a defensively-focused tanks. With every expender of the Zeal mechanic being defensive in nature aside from Divine Reckoning (which requires sword oath), PLD will have more tools to protect the party with.

Zeal functions differently than Wrath / Abandon in it stacks slower, and is not entirely consumed when you use a Zeal-costing ability. It is a more granular resource.

I think that Blocking magical attacks is outside the PLD's scope, and falls into DRK's territory of mitigating magical / unaspected damage.
_________________________________________________________

Maybe then I would play PLD aside from times when I'm feline lazy.

I'll post WAR and DRK ones later.
Reading some of the ideas in this thread really fills me with hope. I was half-expecting most of the posts to say that all the tanks are purrfect.

Good on you guys! \'w'/