With notifications of class quests comin, can we have a more noticeable job tutorial?

[Andrea]

You people act like vote kicking is so hard.

I queue up as a tank. I decide it'll be fun to go as a gladiator. I proceed to be kicked within 5 minutes of the dungeon starting.

Now lets say no one can get a friend to queue up. What happens then? wait god knows how long for a new tank, or back to the long as hell dps queues you go.

Why should I be forced to wait because someone thought it would be fun..?

[TheUltimateSeph]

I queue up as a tank. I decide it'll be fun to go as a gladiator. I proceed to be kicked within 5 minutes of the dungeon starting.

Now lets say no one can get a friend to queue up. What happens then? wait god knows how long for a new tank, or back to the long as hell dps queues you go.

Why should I be forced to wait because someone thought it would be fun..?

I'd say your specific point here with a tank is moot since you literally don't need a tank for any 4 man content if your healer and dps know how to dodge aoes and play efficiently. Hell just yesterday I queued in progress for Keeper of the Lake with two dps, one of whom was new and no tank. They were at the very start of the dungeon and we cleared it pretty fast with the new guy tanking practically the entire thing and we didn't wipe once. Bonus - he was a DRG. Don't really need a healer in most 4-man content either as long as at least one person has cure or physick cross-classed and the dps is high enough. People who insist upon waiting for a 4th person to join after someone leaves / gets kicked are holding themselves back. Not the person they chose to kick.


And really if the tank / healer / third dps isn't needed anyway why bother kicking them for playing on a class in the first place? Because you want to take a chance at getting someone who might be more efficient at their role? This is why I defend "lazy" play and "gimping" yourself. Because if they are actually contributing something to the party you have no one but yourself to blame when the run goes slower because your attitude towards them is bad or you kick them for their choice of playstyle. Can't wait till people follow your train of logic further down the tracks and start vote kicking people who's gear simply doesn't meet their standards.

[Andrea]

I'd say your specific point here with a tank is moot since you literally don't need a tank for any 4 man content if your healer and dps know how to dodge aoes and play efficiently.

1. You may not need a tank or a healer or even a fourth DPS at times if your party is competent. I know this. However to go into DF as a class just for the lols is rude. You simply cannot do the same damage as a class as you could a job.
2. It takes time to gear up. It takes almost no time at all once you hit 30 to get your job crystal. They are in no way at all similar.
3. Of course my attitude is going to be bad towards someone who is making stuff take even longer because they thought it was funny. Not even taking into consideration that they are effecting other people that didn't agree to it at all. Hell, I bet some people thought it was funny to run stuff with crafting/gathering gear on. Should I be ok with that too? of course I shouldn't, anyone with a brain would understand that.

I will admit though, I got a good laugh out of you trying to hide the fact your choose to gimp yourself by not equipping a job stone to someone who was still gearing up.

[Legion88]

I'd say your specific point here with a tank is moot since you literally don't need a tank for any 4 man content...

This is a failure of the system and depends on player skill and overgearing.
Don't think to use this as an apologize.

Just reduce the job stone to an equipable item. What will you say to a player who has no body armour or no accessoires? A job stone gives you not only extra stats like a normal equipable item it gives you depending on your level and quests done, exclusive skills.

So we should handle a player above level 30 without a job stone like a player with just the half of his gear equipped.

[Amelia_Pond_Behemoth]

I don't know how much it would help, but maybe your new job trainer(s) could be introduced to you at the end of the class questline. Adjust it so the job quest flag isn't with the job trainer, but with the guildmaster. You accept his quest(s) and run off to the job trainer. You then see a red triangle above the job trainer's head. You talk to the trainer and get told that you must be at least level 30 MRD and 15 GLA to continue the quest.

That way it gets your attention right away when you complete your final class quest, and you're able to learn enough of what you should do to continue.

[Awful]

I'd rather it be until you reach lvl 30 in the MSQ and it gives you a quest to your new job trainer or at the end of your lvl 30 class quest it tells you on the map where to go find them and they'll tell you that the player needs to get their sub class as well. It's funny that we're talking about this because I had a lvl 42 gladiator in Stone Vigil this week and died so fast on the first and second pull that the healer just gave up and left.

[Felis]

I don't know how much it would help, but maybe your new job trainer(s) could be introduced to you at the end of the class questline. Adjust it so the job quest flag isn't with the job trainer, but with the guildmaster.

Uh, we have this already.
You finish the lv30 class quest and a new quest icon appears over the guildmaster. In that new quest you will meet your job teacher.

[Zojha]

Uh, we have this already.
You finish the lv30 class quest and a new quest icon appears over the guildmaster. In that new quest you will meet your job teacher.

Not for all classes mind you! I some cases it's the receptionist instead. (MNK and Scholar off the top of my head)

That's why I say: Put them "all" on the class trainer. And get rid of the sub-class requirement, because that way, it's available right when you hit 30, so it gets rid of the "Red quest" issue as well. Only way to "miss" them then is to not do the class quests at all.

[TheUltimateSeph]

Well I guess people can still role play a class and simply not use any of their "job" skills if they removed classes or locked classes out of 30+ content. Really no matter how much it may tick people off there is no way you can ever stop this short of perma banning people and good luck with that. Also to all these arguments saying it's rude and selfish etc. for people to gimp themselves like this, I just wanna say you come off at least equally as selfish in your complaints. It's always they are slowing down MY run, wasting MY time, ruining MY experience. It's MY sub and I shouldn't have to play with these bad players. So much Me Me Me

[Noxifer]

Well, maybe because most of the red quest you see while you do your leveling mean it's a crafting quest.

Um... actually, most red quests you see while levelling mean you're not high enough (level-wise) to accept them. And if you click on them, you get the "accept quest" window, explaining what you need to unlock the quest.