With notifications of class quests comin, can we have a more noticeable job tutorial?

[TheUltimateSeph]

I'd say go one further, lock MSQ 30+ behind jobs only, and all dungeons past level 30 (and guildhests 30+) can only be queued for by jobs, and all raids and trials can only be queued for on jobs, and same for PvP. Also, all mobs above level 50 gain a wombo combo move that will 1-hit kill ANYONE on a class that they use instantly on a class upon aggro (no cast time, they're immune to stuns etc, 500 yalm range).

Not only that but if you're killed by this move 3 times in a week, your character gets instantly deleted. No undoing.

Can't really tell where you stopped being serious here but I'm guessing around the mob 1 hit to class bit. The reason you want dungeons and trials locked behind a job is one of the very reasons it will never happen. Many people enjoy making premade parties and doing content with classes for an extra challenge. To lock content behind jobs denies them the ability to do something they have every right to attempt. Also correct me if I'm wrong but I'm pretty sure Law gear is class/job equipable as opposed to Eso gear which is job only. SE clearly supports the fact that people even at level 60 may want to play without a job stone.

[Paladinleeds]

Can't really tell where you stopped being serious here but I'm guessing around the mob 1 hit to class bit. The reason you want dungeons and trials locked behind a job is one of the very reasons it will never happen. Many people enjoy making premade parties and doing content with classes for an extra challenge. To lock content behind jobs denies them the ability to do something they have every right to attempt. Also correct me if I'm wrong but I'm pretty sure Law gear is class/job equipable as opposed to Eso gear which is job only. SE clearly supports the fact that people even at level 60 may want to play without a job stone.

Then make all later gear hidden behind a job stone. I was being serious with every single part of my post.

[Canadane]

There's actually a fair deal of advantage going into some pvp modes as a base class, not a job.

[FoxyAreku]

There's actually a fair deal of advantage going into some pvp modes as a base class, not a job.

Really? I know this was true back at level 50, but with the new job abilities in heavensward I have trouble thinking of any class that would have a perk to it. The new abilities are just so good.

I would start with scratching the secondary class requirement for a job, then putting the job quest onto the class trainer so they can be picked up right as you finish your lvl 30 quest.

Should be enough, really. If there's still a large amount of newbies unable to find their way to a job, then you may consider locking MSQ or similar behind it.

Problem with that though is those secondary jobs are actually kinda important. Black mages need raging strikes, scholars need to have protect and cleric stance, etc.

[NovaLevossida]

Problem with that though is those secondary jobs are actually kinda important. Black mages need raging strikes, scholars need to have protect and cleric stance, etc.

I met a level 60 WAR in a mix of regular / upgraded Ironworks gear who didn't have GLD leveled high enough for Provoke and apparently got to the level cap in that gear set. Those secondary abilities are important, but bad players will find a way regardless.

[Noxifer]

Really? I know this was true back at level 50, but with the new job abilities in heavensward I have trouble thinking of any class that would have a perk to it. The new abilities are just so good.

Well, there are still level 50 pvp things where you're synched down. But, since I don't do pvp, I have no idea how abandoned those pvp modes are or not.

Problem with that though is those secondary jobs are actually kinda important. Black mages need raging strikes, scholars need to have protect and cleric stance, etc.

Well, just because you don't need another class to unlock the job doesn't mean crossclass skills won't be available from that class. But yeah, it'll mean people won't necessarily even notice there is such a thing as crossclass skills. I know it's a pain to figure out and/or remember which classes have the crossclass skills for the class/job I'm levelling if it's one I'm not familiar with already. (On alts, usually, because on my main I already have all the ARR classes unlocked so the skills menu gives me that information readily.)

When I meet people where the lack of crossclass skills is obvious (such as healers without swiftcast), I tend to suggest that they might want to level xxx class in order to get access to skills that will make their job a lot easier. Sometimes, they're all "yeah I knoooow, it's just such a pain to level something I'm not interested in", but many times they didn't even know that was a thing. ^^;
That's one thing I wish SE would make easier as well. For example by having the new job trainer mention that practising with xxx class really helped him become a better [whatever job s/he is]. Or through the game system itself somehow.

[Alistaire]

Really? I know this was true back at level 50, but with the new job abilities in heavensward I have trouble thinking of any class that would have a perk to it. The new abilities are just so good.

They're also ignoring the flat damage bonuses they gave to jobs a while ago. There's absolutely not a case in pvp for anyone using a class now.

That being said, right @ 30 and for a bit there's a couple of jobs that actually do benefit from being a class rather than job. And those that don't have that luxury are at least close enough to full potential before 35 that if someone's competent with it I'd be fine with seeing the class in a dungeon @ 35. Granted someone else's post of a mrd35 not using overpower, that's more a problem with them not knowing how to tank, not that they were mrd. A MRD 35 (at least now) doesn't lose much of their damage stat, only vit, and gets access to invigorate, raging strikes, and can really hold their own vs a war35 of equal skill. Hell even @ 50 at one point lancer was only somethin like 3% dps lower than DRG, and CNJ was as good if not better than WHM in a certain garuda ex solo heal strat, relying on dps burst boosts to kill it before needing to hide in the shield.

[Zojha]

Problem with that though is those secondary jobs are actually kinda important. Black mages need raging strikes, scholars need to have protect and cleric stance, etc.

Swiftcast is a lvl 26 spell. Not within the lvl 15 range. Provoke comes at 22. Invigorate at 22, Blood for Blood at 34. DRGs don't get Internal Release on the way et cetera. White mages and Scholars don't need THM at all, surely Swiftcast is not important!

Just to name the typical must haves. The point falls flat because leveling these classes to 15 does not provide you with many if not most of the most important cross class skills.

[FoxyAreku]

Swiftcast is a lvl 26 spell. Not within the lvl 15 range. Provoke comes at 22. Invigorate at 22, Blood for Blood at 34. DRGs don't get Internal Release on the way et cetera. White mages and Scholars don't need THM at all, surely Swiftcast is not important!

Just to name the typical must haves. The point falls flat because leveling these classes to 15 does not provide you with many if not most of the most important cross class skills.

Protect is a little more important than those skills. They are all must haves, but you won't get kicked from most pugs for not having them. No protect on scholar is kickable outside of very early dungeons.

Though I guess they could just make protect and cleric baseline for all healers.

[_slowpoke_]

Making unlocking a job a requirement at some point in the MSQ in the thirties is actually a brilliant idea. Introduce it as a non-optional quest that explains why you would want to upgrade your class to a job and leads you to an NPC that gives you information about how to unlock each job, and which you can return to if you ever need that information again.