Thread: 3.2 Patch Notes

Originally Posted by Andrea

I understand you know how to play your class. I also like that you have admitted to playing songs without the need to be asked for them as I believe every bard should be.

However couldn't your claim of I know how best to play my own class be used against you? Wouldn't the healer know when they needed MP more than you would know?

Usually if a healer does tell me to turn it off after a reasonable amount of time has passed, I assume they'll be fine and/or their own regens are back up (particularly with SCH). It's only when they're almost completely depleted of MP that I kind of ??? at them for telling me to turn Ballad off just because of the slight hit to my dps (after I've already turned on cooldowns and have Battle Voice up so that the regen goes faster and thus lets me drop it quicker). At that point it makes little sense to me as both a bard and as someone who's played a healer and knows each healer's mana regen abilities and how long they take to act.

Basically if someone is telling me to turn it off when their MP is in a reasonable or manageable state, I will. If their MP is almost gone and I literally just turned on Ballad and popped cooldowns and their MP is still too low for comfort, that's when I don't because to me, it feels like a bad idea. I know how to play my class, but I can't always say the same for others - is the gist of it.

Originally Posted by Warlyx

think about for a min a party of tank , melee , bard (you) , healer , boss fight , why you would cast MP song here? u are losing 15% dmg because that , wouldnt be better if u cast FOE so the healers does more dmg? and u lose nothing casting foe (+BV), if the healers runs out of MP for nuking is the damn healer fault , no1 can blame a bard on that....

.... If the healer is prioritizing dpsing over healing the tank, I'm not going to give them Foe's. Half the time I never have Foe's up in a group with no mages because I'm there assuming the healer will primarily focus on their main job - which is healing. Just as I primarily focus on my main job, which is dpsing - until such a time as I need to use one of my support skills to assist someone (usually the healer) with regenerative abilities.

I'd be casting MP song so the healer has enough MP to actually heal the tank, rather than encouraging them to keep dpsing and ignoring the tank's health by having Foe's up.

And once again, I can easily make up for the hit a Ballad takes on my damage by popping cooldowns when I have to drop into it. Most of the time I rarely have to keep Ballad up for more than a few seconds before the healer's good on MP and I can turn it off and return to doing my highest output.

Originally Posted by Kaoru_Nagisa

Half the time I never have Foe's up in a group with no mages because I'm there assuming the healer will primarily focus on their main job - which is healing. Just as I primarily focus on my main job, which is dpsing - until such a time as I need to use one of my support skills to assist someone (usually the healer) with regenerative abilities.

I'd be casting MP song so the healer has enough MP to actually heal the tank, rather than encouraging them to keep dpsing and ignoring the tank's heal by having Foe's up.

And once again, I can easily make up for the hit a Ballad takes on my damage by popping cooldowns when I have to drop into it. Most of the time I rarely have to keep Ballad up for more than a few seconds before the healer's good on MP and I can turn it off and return to doing my highest output.

healer dps is actually very competitive, add FOE + BV (+20% dmg ) .....is not like u need to heal all the time , healing 4 mans is boring as hell , i despise dpsing on my healer i would prefer having things to heal and what not, thats why im playing healer in the 1 place....but oh well thats another issue ..u dont need to heal all the time ...and while jumping/dancing around the tank and dps while they fight a boss is fun for a while lol ....dpsing and killing the mobs faster and finishing the duty at hand sooner is important for all the 4(8) members.

if your healer isnt dpsing yeah dont waste your time on Foe , hell maybe try to talk to him/her....want to dps? i can put foe + BV for u if u want (for sure he/she will feel special oh u will sing just for me? ,and will say hell yeah! ) , and there u go all the 4 going town and kill the boss faster

edit : sorry if sounded "harsh" on my post not my intention at all ^^U /thumbs up /cheer

Originally Posted by Warlyx

im sorry but u are doing it wrong :/ , healer dps is actually very competitive, add FOE + BV (+20% dmg ) .....is not like u need to heal all the time , healing 4 mans is boring as hell ,

if your healer isnt dpsing yeah dont waste your time on Foe , hell maybe try to talk to him/her....want to dps? i can put foe + BV for u if u want (for sure he/she will feel special oh u will sing just for me? ,and will say hell yeah! ) , and there u go all the 4 going town and kill the boss faster

There is absolutely no reason for a healer to prioritize dpsing over their primary job, which is healing. I am not the one playing my class wrong in the case of not putting up Foe's for an overzealous healer who's putting the party at risk by acting as if they're a crappy black mage - they are.

And I am also not going to badger a healer into dpsing if they are not doing so - most of the time it isn't necessary, and every healer has their own reasons for wanting to avoid dpsing or at least avoid dropping into CS. I'm not going to bug an obviously-not-interested healer into doing something that isn't part of their job description.

I'm starting to be happier to have switched to summoner as my alt's main class - people are becoming almost ridiculous when it comes to what a bard should and shouldn't do.

Originally Posted by Kaoru_Nagisa

There is absolutely no reason for a healer to prioritize dpsing over their primary job, which is healing. I am not the one playing my class wrong in the case of not putting up Foe's for an overzealous healer who's putting the party at risk by acting as if they're a crappy black mage - they are.

And I am also not going to badger a healer into dpsing if they are not doing so - most of the time it isn't necessary, and every healer has their own reasons for wanting to avoid dpsing or at least avoid dropping into CS. I'm not going to bug an obviously-not-interested healer into doing something that isn't part of their job description.

yeah i see what u are saying ...i have been there too , i understand healers not wanting to dps (kinda agree somehow with the feeling) , and u cant force them to dps if they just refuse to do so....but asking doesnt hurt !

<foe requiem> + <battle voice> <you can have this!> , <cleric stance> <yes, please!> :3 , and more than half go dps mode , sometimes it works ^^

what i tried to say is that, if a healer goes out of mp because dpsing ...that isnt your fault , u arent there to be a mp battery for a overzealous healer that goes all out dpsing and forgets to heal...ballad wont save u in that scenario :P nothing will to be fair outside the party wiping and healer gasp...healing

Originally Posted by Warlyx

u cant force them to dps if they just refuse to do so....but asking doesnt hurt !

<foe requiem> + <battle voice> <you can have this!> , <cleric stance> <yes, please!> :3 , and more than half go dps mode , sometimes it works ^^

what i tried to say is that, if a healer goes out of mp because dpsing ...that isnt your fault , u arent there to be a mp battery for a overzealous healer that goes all out dpsing and forgets to heal...ballad wont save u in that scenario :P nothing will to be fair outside the party wiping and healer gasp...healing

It isn't a fact of whether it's working or not - it's the fact that I am not going to ask something of a healer that they are by no means required to do. It'd be like someone coming to me on my summoner and demanding I heal and res people just so the healer doesn't have to - just because I still have access to those skills does not mean I should be asked or forced to use them. And it'd be the same as people demanding I play healer on a class that is not a healer - just as people keep wanting to demand healers play dps on a class that is not a dps. It's ridiculous and pointless in non-hardcore content, and I'm not going to be a part of it.

And I know it isn't my fault if a healer runs low on MP because they focus more on dpsing than healing - but I still do not like wiping, and I have been able to allow a healer to keep the tank alive after they ran dry on MP just by way of playing Ballad for a few seconds so they could throw out a heal. Usually if a healer keeps doing that sort of behavior, however, I just refuse to give them MP song. At that point they're just being counterproductive to everyone.

Originally Posted by DGladius

It's the whole party/raid job to output the most party/raid wide dps as possible. While it's not needed especially for healers to dps in dungeons and other easy content, they are absolutely able dish out loads of damage particularly in trash pulls meaning things die faster and less healing is needed if done properly. I don't think anyone said for a healer to prioritize dpsing over healing. But healers are able to do both effectively with no problems. Again, if tp/mp is not needed than it's not needed clear as that.

Please stop dictating what is and isn't everyone's job - the party's job is just to get through the dungeon. That's it. There is nothing more to it. How fast/slow they do so just depends on the people in the group and what they feel comfortable doing or are able to do.