New Prelim Tank updates

[Phoenicia]

Yeah I get what he's doing now, thanks.

I did not intend to "talk down" really and sorry if it came out as such a way. But as someone who has been harassed in the past to "switch" jobs for specific fights because they're better (and I can play them), I get triggered by such misinformed demands.

Examples like when some idiot tells me "Switch to PLD because WAR sucks in T9" when we are ilv130, which after a long argument the healer said "Healing Phoenicia's WAR was easier than all our PLDs in the FC". Or when someone tells me to use BLM instead of SMN because that other BLM he knows did 420 DPS only to be proven wrong when I do 450 on my SMN at ilv110. Why does it trigger me? It's needless "bossiness" that start unnecessary arguments when they are in the wrong and have no right forit when it doesn't even matter any more in the fist place. No body cares about min/maxing a T9 sell at ilv130 gear, right? Anyways I won't derail more.

Back to math. As people around the forum process data so wrongly and then "streamline" potency on all tank moves and then they come to IB and fail to do it (calling it a 300 potency which would mean it would barely do 1.02x the damage of BB while it does way more). If you want to call DA+SE a 400 potency move under Grit, IB is a 400 potency move under Defiance.

I'll use relative numbers instead of just multiplying/dividing by percentages to make it a bit clearer like when you calculated BB in comparison to IB for example:

IB:BB = IB damage compared to BB.

Absolute values under Defiance where IB ignores penalty (300) and BB loses 25% (210) without Maim:

300:210 = 1.43:1

Absolute values with Maim:

360:252 = 1.43:1

Comparative values with defiance penalty as "base value" and no Maim:

400:280 = 1.43:1

What the above means is: For each point of damage BB does, IB does 1.43.

What I am doing is keeping the potency of IB relative to the rest of WAR's other skills. Just like how DRK's DA+SE is 400 potency (regardless of buffs), WAR's IB is 400 potency (regardless f buffs). Absolutes (with buffs Grit+Darkness and Def+Main) you have DA:SE at 368 and IB at 360. (not taking slashing down because it will apply to both classes).

Basically what SE is doing by having it at 300 potency ignoring defiance is excluding it from Unchained's 33% damage buff. Basically removing 25% penalty back to 100% is the same as 33% damage increase if you consider the 75% of base as the "new base".

I hope this clears any misunderstanding in where how I'm treating the numbers and I apologize again if I sounded as a "down talker".

...Gordias only made people realize what was already there, and what will probably always be...

DPS aren't all at the same numbers, but they tend be balanced around their utility. With the same skilled players and the same gear, you could take probably any reasonable setup and achieve the same raid DPS ("Reasonable" meaning no 4 BRD parties )

I like how you bring up the "real" issues that matter. "What was already there" is "want for efficiency". As I said somewhere else: It's human nature: If something feels more efficient, they will do it.

As for the DPS not doing the same numbers, that is because, as long as it's reasonable, no matter the setup: You end up with the same raid DPS. Example: NIN does less damage than MNK, but it adds enough DPS to tanks and MNK (and everyone else) that it makes up for its inherently lower DPS. Another example: BRD and SMN do less DPS than BLM, but they have higher up time than BLM where BLM drops DPS as it move while SMN and BRD have DoTs ticking and instants to use while moving.

[Instrumentality]

As for the DPS not doing the same numbers, that is because, as long as it's reasonably, no matter the setup: You end up with the same raid DPS. Example: NIN does less damage than MNK, but it adds enough DPS to tanks and MNK (and everyone else) that it makes up for its inherently lower DPS. Another example: BRD and SMN do less DPS than BLM, but they have higher up time than BLM where BLM drops DPS as it move while SMN and BRD have DoTs ticking and instants to use while moving.

This is a pretty good example for dps, and I agree with it. It doesn't translate at all to tanks, though, because in this example Warrior would have the highest uptime, the best dps, the most utility, and the most diverse and usable mitigation toolkit. Bringing a warrior to a raid has no downside. You don't 'trade away' anything for it because it is quite simply much better than anything else you could put in that slot because it is the best at the four things I just listed.

And buffing the other tanks to match it will never happen because it doesn't seem like SE understands where the fundamental breakdown is between Warrior and not-Warrior tanks. In that the only way to make other tanks competitive with Warrior is to make them much better at at least one of the above four things.