DPS: Why is it so dang taboo?

[Eul]

The statement "Could you AoE please?" for example, can be read as either snide or polite.

I met English party (I guess they from Masamune) that teach me (ninja) to AoE at mobs. At first I'm thinking like why should I AoE? This is low level dungeon (Brayflox NM). But it proofs me that when I AoE it clears faster lol.

Sometimes you need to follow their style not just your ego to complete the duty.

[Urthdigger]

I met English party (I guess they from Masamune) that teach me (ninja) to AoE at mobs. At first I'm thinking like why should I AoE? This is low level dungeon (Brayflox NM). But it proofs me that when I AoE it clears faster lol.

Sometimes you need to follow their style not just your ego to complete the duty.

Unfortunately many DPS do not see it that way.

[Jim_Berry]

I just wanna start out saying, I main bard and I'm not exactly new, so I get how it goes as a dps. (Cleared thor and Alex S 1/2... screw 3). I also know the answer before I ask this so consider i for rhetoric's sake.

Why is everyone so touchy about their dps when they're told to step it up? Almost every single other mainstream MMO has some form of in game metric for dps aside from 'can i clear xyz.' Healers and tanks don't get a free pass, why do dps? Most dps complain too when a tank or healer makes one slip up, but 2/4 dps can drag 8 people down and suddenly you're a 'toxic' player for pointing it out.

I really, really, really wish parsing was a native function and we didn't have to use 3rd party stuff. I love ACT but I honestly believe this community could use a good wake up.

Anyway to avoid complain thread: ITT discuss times dps stood out to you!

It becomes touchy due to the way we read it. Most of the times, it sounds harsh when you read it and hear someone voice as you're reading it. The thing is, sometimes we ARE trying our hardest; could just be a bad day for us. One day, I was constantly pushing 1200+ dps on Faust. After four wipes, my dps got lower, and lower, and lower, down to the point where after 6 or 7 wipes, I was at about 800 dps due to fatigue. At that point, I was told to step it. Like, really? after 7 wipes, y'all want to blame it on me?

[Jim_Berry]

I met English party (I guess they from Masamune) that teach me (ninja) to AoE at mobs. At first I'm thinking like why should I AoE? This is low level dungeon (Brayflox NM). But it proofs me that when I AoE it clears faster lol.

Sometimes you need to follow their style not just your ego to complete the duty.

I agree! But then they find something else to complain about. Some time ago, I used Katon then Kassatsu + Doton. One of the members told me to do Doton then Kassatsu + Katon. I asked why, but he would never say, even after I asked about three times.

[CGMidlander]

It becomes touchy due to the way we read it. Most of the times, it sounds harsh when you read it and hear someone voice as you're reading it. The thing is, sometimes we ARE trying our hardest; could just be a bad day for us. One day, I was constantly pushing 1200+ dps on Faust. After four wipes, my dps got lower, and lower, and lower, down to the point where after 6 or 7 wipes, I was at about 800 dps due to fatigue. At that point, I was told to step it. Like, really? after 7 wipes, y'all want to blame it on me?

6-7 wipes will drop your DPS 33%? I can understand if you start getting weary after, say, a whole queue's timer, but frankly, tiring that much after 6-7 wipes is some pretty underwhelming endurance.

[Galgarion]

Speaking of strawman arguments...

You completely misunderstood what I was saying and decided to just lump me in with all other "PC" arguments. My point is that there is no possible way to be constructive with any kind of criticism towards the people I was talking about. You can be as positive as you want about it, but any response other that blatantly lying and saying "no, you're perfectly fine" is an affront to humanity and the subject of demonization. I've seen more people explode over politely phrased pointers than I can count.

My argument had absolutely nothing to do with being rude. I'm not advocating being a douchebag. I was trying to point out that the reality of our society now is exactly what happened with your response. No matter how you try and phrase something, some emotionally stunted person is going to flip their shit because you didn't lie to them and tell them exactly what they wanted to hear.

The gnome raises a good point. I've been in three free companies last year where people rage quit with a bunch of drama and whinging because you can't even tell people how they can improve over teamspeak in a friendly conversation. People don't want to be critiqued, they want to be told that they're awesome, the best, the greatest, one hundred percent pure sex with lightning bolt hip thrusts, and anything less than an affirmation of how wonderful they are is grounds for the ignore list and a smear campaign. It's both crazy and disgusting.

[Ilitsa]

The gnome raises a good point. I've been in three free companies last year where people rage quit with a bunch of drama and whinging because you can't even tell people how they can improve over teamspeak in a friendly conversation. People don't want to be critiqued, they want to be told that they're awesome, the best, the greatest, one hundred percent pure sex with lightning bolt hip thrusts, and anything less than an affirmation of how wonderful they are is grounds for the ignore list and a smear campaign. It's both crazy and disgusting.

SOME people are like that, yes, not everyone. Vast majority will listen if the person "critiquing" isn't being condescending. Case and point, was in a Sohm Al run just tonight, where the blm was opening with thunder 3 and using 3 fires to get the Astral III status, I calmly explained that opening with a thunder 2, and use thunder 3 on thundercloud procs, and that using fire 3 is far more mana efficient, and adding in using Blizz 3 before the fire 3 for reduced mp cost on the fire, as well if so wished, they simply thanked me and began doing as I had said. There was no name calling, no drama, but, according to you and snuggles, interactions like this are impossible and NEVER happen. I'm FAR from a perfect rotation BLM, but I am decent enough to offer small tidbits of advice here and there, I have lots of room to improve myself, though, so if I stumble across someone that wants to politely explain something, I'll gladly listen. I'm under no obligation though to listen to someone that's being a rude, pompous, belittling jerk, however.

[Galgarion]

...according to you and snuggles, interactions like this are impossible and NEVER happen..

Where did either of us once write "It is impossible and never happens,"? Snuggles and I merely pointed out the frequency with which it does occur. Your obstinate 'teaspoon of sugar' defense provides not the slightest surcease if the person in question is a deluded egomaniac as these games are wont to attract.

"Hey, if you keep blood of the dragon up you'll hit harder--"

"SILENCE! SILENCE! RAAAAAGH!!!"

This is an exaggeration. For realism, substitute "Silence, silence! Raaagh!" With "STFU, I know my class!"

[Animarelic]

The problem stems from several sources. We currently live in the society of the participation trophy. Self esteem is considered more important than hard work so everyone gets a prize. People are coddled from a young age and any form of criticism, whether its constructive or not, is immediately evil. Our society's overblown focus on political correctness has demonized anything that could possibly be construed as slightly negative. Everything must sound like a my little pony commercial or you're a hateful bully that can't be tolerated.

Kosmos also had it right with the single player game mentality. Games have evolved into glorified button-mashers. Strategy and practice is a thing of the past. If it weren't for games like dark souls, people who like to be challenged would have no outlet.

All of these things compiled lead to one inevitable outcome: butthurt.

This is the most Valid point on this thread and defensive replies validates that. People will always try to make up for their short comings with an excuse and sometimes no matter how well you "candy coat" it they will still get offended by you.
I can count on one hand how many times a group failed a DPS check and any individuals asks " Was it me?" or "How can I get better?" Most don't they walk off and repeat the same mistakes over and over until they become unwanted.

Most players don't have an Epiphany they are forced into the realization they are playing incorrectly anyways. So why not be tactfully upfront in the first place? it'll only make them better.

[Miste]

SOME people are like that, yes, not everyone. Vast majority will listen if the person "critiquing" isn't being condescending. Case and point, was in a Sohm Al run just tonight, where the blm was opening with thunder 3 and using 3 fires to get the Astral III status, I calmly explained that opening with a thunder 2, and use thunder 3 on thundercloud procs, and that using fire 3 is far more mana efficient, and adding in using Blizz 3 before the fire 3 for reduced mp cost on the fire, as well if so wished, they simply thanked me and began doing as I had said. There was no name calling, no drama, but, according to you and snuggles, interactions like this are impossible and NEVER happen. I'm FAR from a perfect rotation BLM, but I am decent enough to offer small tidbits of advice here and there, I have lots of room to improve myself, though, so if I stumble across someone that wants to politely explain something, I'll gladly listen. I'm under no obligation though to listen to someone that's being a rude, pompous, belittling jerk, however.

As far as I can see neither of them said that polite interactions never happen...but I agree with them that it seems to happen a lot that critiquing anyone ends badly.

I could name all the times I have politely asked a question or offered some advice and have been assaulted with profanities in response or even some occasions unjustly kicked from the group but it would take too much time. In my personal experiences 90% of the time I myself have offered help/advice, or when I've seen another member in the group do so, it ends badly. The player who is on the receiving end of the help/advice usually freaks out and gets immediately defensive no matter how politely people talked to them.

Maybe you've just been lucky? Or I have just been unlucky? It's really not something we can figure out a statistic on without running some kinda crazy study on the subject. Vast majority is only in your personal experiences, not everyone's. My personal experience for example is opposite of yours and I always ask/explain politely.