Why is so hard for newbies to learn how to raid?

[jssanderson747]

From the perspective of a raid leader, the honest answer I have for you is simple. We don't want to waste a raid night wiping for otherwise preventable reasons. I can understand that mindset as someone who's cleared AS1-2 every week for a while now. As for fights that we haven't cleared, it's just generally preferable to have someone who understands how to perform on their role. If we wipe because the tank popped zero cds when they were needed, there's no point in bringing them into AS3, because they would never have gotten there normally.
My advice is pretty straightforward, find a static for Midas savage. You can clear these fights in pf, but if you're 5 months late, no one on your server is likely to care if you want to learn.

[BrokenFox]

3 Types of Raid clears

Raiders that only do static party learn the fight and understand everyone roles.
Raiders who can't do static party but willing to learn and understand there role in the fight.
Raiders who are happy clearing just once regardless of what it takes.

Group 1 doesn't help group 2 or 3.

Group 2 players are hard to find because there are so many group 3, and most group 3 players believe they are group 2.

So group 2 end up trying with group 3 where the level of commitment just isn't there.

Accurate

Hardcore raiding is trash in any MMO unless you're with a dedicated group of guildies. Otherwise don't bother. It just isn't fun.

[karateorangutang]

I too am on the slow side of content clearing simply for time, but usually if I put up a learning party in PF for just about anything, then I get a full party withing 20 minutes or so. Sometimes faster.

[MeiUshu]

snips.

my goodness.. this is just ..soo wrong.. any new will be late ..ANY new player will be late because guess what tyhe didnt start a century ago. How are they going to enjoy the content that nobody is willing to help them with in the first place ? since according to you most of the players by the time those new addition reach that level will be well over it and dont care IF someone else needs help..my goodness...and people Wonder why I lost faith in this comunity

[FinalWolf]

my goodness.. this is just ..soo wrong.. any new will be late ..ANY new player will be late because guess what tyhe didnt start a century ago. How are they going to enjoy the content that nobody is willing to help them with in the first place ? since according to you most of the players by the time those new addition reach that level will be well over it and dont care IF someone else needs help..my goodness...and people Wonder why I lost faith in this comunity

Well most people won't give a shit the only thing I can tell you is to keep making learning groups.

[LineageRazor]

I static with a five-member team that can meet only once a week for about three hours due to the limited playtime of our members (one of us is in grad school, many of us have children under the age of five that require a lot of attention). Our practice time is very, very precious, so it can be a real downer when we request experienced pick-up members in our party finder and wind up with someone who turns out to be... well, not-so experienced. Our already slow progression rate is slowed even further.

As an example, we have not passed Thordan's Meteor phase as a group in almost two months of practice. Why? Because each week, one or two of the members we pick up either lied about their experience or just clicked join without reading the "Meteor progression" part of our party finder message. It's pretty aggravating; the five of us know what we're doing up to Meteors, but even one party member down can make it difficult to get past it.

So that, at least, is one reason why you see folks looking for experienced party members in party finder. In order to progress through difficult content like this, you simply can't hand-hold a new set of newcomers every week.

[Solebound]

So i took the advise given, i advertised myself on my server, one person asked me what my main was with no follow up question, then found another pf up saying A1S and A2S weekly clear, asked if the person is willing to teach, the person in turn said they never done A2S before. So i guess he/she was looking for a carry. I didn't know this was a common thing when you put up a PF. I thought everyone respected the parameters of what the recruitment leader was looking for. I guess its naive on my part. No one else responded to my pf. Thinking maybe I should wait till another friend of mine comes on later because he is in the same predicament as me

[AlexiIvaniskavich]

.......

There is a difference in players who are wanting to work at their job and a fight and those who simply wish to be carried for their 1 clear. I can't tell you how many times I have PUGd ThorEx over the last month and seen people make multiple, simple mistakes that can easily be corrected, but the player skill just isn't there. I have seen PLD as MT out dps actual DD's, I have seen SCH out damage actual DD's as well.

At this point in content, there is enough information out there that players shouldn't be dying to stupid things consistently. If you are already raiding a significant number of hours, this is a very frustrating aspect to deal with.

OP -

Continue the path of learning parties, strive for perfection on your job, WORK for your progress within each fight. Hard work will get noticed, and people (even raiders) are much more willing to work with you, if they feel that you are willing to put forth effort.

[ThirdChild_ZKI]

It takes time. The same time no one really has, but we have to make. If I were on your server, I'd be glad to help cause I never forgot where I came from, and I'd rather other players aren't left high and dry like I was.

But yes, grab your friend. And have them grab their other friend. Build a team. Keep trying. Keep failing. But keep TRYING. You'll be amazed what you're capable of.

[Ashkendor]

I see people try this all the time on the weekends while stalking PF for pony farms, but they rarely fill up. Specifically for A1S they never usually get to more than 3 or 4 people.

It's barely even a band-aid. A lot of people make these recommendations, and while they are nice in theory, in practice it doesn't always work as well.

Uh. My server's a lot less populated than yours and learning/clear parties typically fill within 15-20 minutes at peak times. Then again, right now in particular we have a lot of really bored people looking for stuff to do to kill time till the next patch. Hell, I joined an A1S party last week (or the week before maybe?) that turned out to be a total trap. 6/8 of us thought the new guy knew the fight. One other person knew he'd never been in there but didn't say anything until after we'd killed Faust (lol). 4/8 of us were on roles we weren't familiar with. End result? We got a clear for two people and I've cleared A1S as a Scholar now.

my goodness.. this is just ..soo wrong.. any new will be late ..ANY new player will be late because guess what tyhe didnt start a century ago. How are they going to enjoy the content that nobody is willing to help them with in the first place ? since according to you most of the players by the time those new addition reach that level will be well over it and dont care IF someone else needs help..my goodness...and people Wonder why I lost faith in this comunity

So you really can't understand why 7/8 of a static would want to just go in and painlessly clear content they've been clearing for weeks instead of spending hours of their raid night walking some pug through it? You're not even trying to see it from anyone else's point of view but your own then. Seriously, a lot of veteran players will join those learning/clear parties (on my server, at least) but we can't join what isn't even there. That whole "faith in the community" thing goes two ways, though. The fact of the matter is that veteran players have every right to have their own goals for their playtime. They have already put in the time required to learn the fight and if they only want people "on their level" to join their static raid time, there is absolutely nothing wrong with that. There is no "No Raider Left Behind" law at work here. Veterans do not exist for the sole purpose of carrying newcomers through content.