Why is so hard for newbies to learn how to raid?

[CrystalRainbow]

3 Types of Raid clears

Raiders that only do static party learn the fight and understand everyone roles.
Raiders who can't do static party but willing to learn and understand there role in the fight.
Raiders who are happy clearing just once regardless of what it takes.

Group 1 doesn't help group 2 or 3.

Group 2 players are hard to find because there are so many group 3, and most group 3 players believe they are group 2.

So group 2 end up trying with group 3 where the level of commitment just isn't there.

[BrokenFox]

3 Types of Raid clears

Raiders that only do static party learn the fight and understand everyone roles.
Raiders who can't do static party but willing to learn and understand there role in the fight.
Raiders who are happy clearing just once regardless of what it takes.

Group 1 doesn't help group 2 or 3.

Group 2 players are hard to find because there are so many group 3, and most group 3 players believe they are group 2.

So group 2 end up trying with group 3 where the level of commitment just isn't there.

Accurate

Hardcore raiding is trash in any MMO unless you're with a dedicated group of guildies. Otherwise don't bother. It just isn't fun.

[RyuRoots]

Accurate

Hardcore raiding is trash in any MMO unless you're with a dedicated group of guildies. Otherwise don't bother. It just isn't fun.

Raiding is only fun if you party with people who don't have a stick up their butt and treat it like a job (which seems to be most static players, who in my experience have been utterly insufferable more often than not). All of my raid clears have come from playing with friends who happened to be on at the time and wanted to play together. The notion that you need a static or some kind of "dedication" to make it worthwhile is ridiculous, e-peen inflating nonsense.

[RiceisNice]

Raiding is only fun if you party with people who don't have a stick up their butt and treat it like a job (which seems to be most static players, who in my experience have been utterly insufferable more often than not). All of my raid clears have come from playing with friends who happened to be on at the time and wanted to play together. The notion that you need a static or some kind of "dedication" to make it worthwhile is ridiculous, e-peen inflating nonsense.

The fact that you're raiding with the same 7 friends over and over is already a form of commitment/dedication. Even then, does this include the likes of A3s and A4s? The latter is what's proving to be the straw that breaks the back when people have to choose between wanting to get content done or sticking with friends (which either means dropping the game/server together, or finding not-savage to do, and a most of the playerbase leans toward the former from what I've seen/heard)

[Solebound]

Thank you all for your replies. I took the advise that many of you wonderful adventurers gave (starting my own learning pf, asking others in the pf if they are willing to teach etc) Even though i did not get positive results with starting my own pf, I asked raiders who wanted to clear content if they where willing to teach me ( via sending them tells on their pf) they kindly said yes after they cleared their own content. Shortly after, a learning party was looking for my role and I told them I was eager and willing to put in the work and dedication and can take constructive criticism. They invited me into their static so i get to do AS1 tonight! They also invited me to do Thordan Ex that same day. We wiped over and over again to the knights , but that didn't phase us because we where having so much fun laughing and joking. I guess I just needed to get out of my cocoon a little bit and be a little more assertive in what I wanted out of this game. Now I have 7 new friends on a server where i only had one or two tops. So you guys where right it is hard, there are raiders who only have a fixed amount of time and cant help newbies, even if they wanted to and I respect that. However there are people out there who want to make the overall raid community better by teaching the mechanics, giving tips for better rotations. Making people feel comfortable and relaxed once you get into that content. I feel like i have a better understanding of my job now then just running the same two dungeons everyday especially when it comes to cool down usage. All i really had to do was just ask the right people. Once I learn this content and future content I think I'm going to pay it forward by starting up regular learning/training parties so that other people can get into the raiding scene, because thordan is challenging at first but its the most FUN I've had in this game. All someone needs is an opportunity, just like I was given one. Then maybe NA server can be just like the JP servers, which was mentioned by another poster.m

Either way thank you all for your responses. It motivated me to not be so shy.

[Mithrahn]

The fact that you're raiding with the same 7 friends over and over is already a form of commitment/dedication. Even then, does this include the likes of A3s and A4s? The latter is what's proving to be the straw that breaks the back when people have to choose between wanting to get content done or sticking with friends (which either means dropping the game/server together, or finding not-savage to do, and a most of the playerbase leans toward the former from what I've seen/heard)

You shouldn't assume that RyuRoots only raid with the same 7 friends, because that's very untrue.

I can't say much about myself though, I don't raid myself, not yet, I'm purposely taking things very slowly.

[Solebound]

So i took the advise given, i advertised myself on my server, one person asked me what my main was with no follow up question, then found another pf up saying A1S and A2S weekly clear, asked if the person is willing to teach, the person in turn said they never done A2S before. So i guess he/she was looking for a carry. I didn't know this was a common thing when you put up a PF. I thought everyone respected the parameters of what the recruitment leader was looking for. I guess its naive on my part. No one else responded to my pf. Thinking maybe I should wait till another friend of mine comes on later because he is in the same predicament as me

[Werhusky]

Raiders that only do static party learn the fight and understand everyone roles.
Raiders who can't do static party but willing to learn and understand there role in the fight.
Raiders who are happy clearing just once regardless of what it takes.

Group 1 doesnt help group 2 or 3

Group 2 players are hard to find because there are so many group 3 and most group 3 players believe they are group 2

Sooo what am I?
I am group 1/2?
For me I gotten to enjoy raiding a lot and I bash my head into new content ASAP and clear pretty soon and farm. On the other hand I have a semi casual raidteam and am somewhat the right hand of the leader due to his time and my determination and experiance. I cleared Thordy in week 2 in a PUG. I cleared A3S in a PUG.
A big part of me is helping others to learn and understand raids. To help clear and progress. I rarely say no...
According to that post I have no place in this raidsystem lol

[Jeykama]

Sooo what am I?
I am group 1/2?

Sad to say, you're still group 1. Even if you enjoy helping, you're still only one person, and one person does not a raid group make. I jump into learning groups all the time but my advice alone isn't going to get them a clear.
Unless I suppose your raid group regularly carries 1-2 people every week through locked content out of the goodness of their hearts. Who does that though?

As for the OP there is something to be said about being just super stubborn, especially as a new player with fewer social connections. I cleared Thordan EX 3rd week or so just hopping into PF learning groups nonstop and since then shadowed the path of a now-friend who struggled to get his Thordan EX clear.

He would just set up PFs day after day, sometimes they would fill, most of the times not. When they filled he would FL the people he liked and invite them to a Thordan-centric LS he made. I would join his groups sometimes and give people tips on phases whatever, and months later he finally cleared. He didn't really have FC support or anything either, just a lot of dedication and maybe spite. But now a lot of people know him and he has a raid group and such. Unfortunately the OP picked a pretty terrible time in the patch cycle to try to progress, hopefully they have better luck in 3.2.

[Werhusky]

Too long

I doubt I am the only one. My friends love to join for clears as well... Maybe we aren't the majority and also often work on double purpose ("Free law" if you want to call it like that after a clear 2 hrs later, Token, chance on mount etc) but we still a good amount of people and some of us on every server