The Price History in the New Market System Needs to be a Lot More Than 20

[Reinheart]

I kind of wanted more of DDO type auction, heard WoW had similar one but better features.
If the item is up on the market you can try to compare/compete with that price but if there is none up on the auction you as a seller have to decide what the value is since it doesn't show any history. If you're not watching the market carefully you may sell the item say 100k item for 20k or on the other hand if you are a buyer and not watching the market carefully you will spend more on something when the average is much lower, if the item is a regularly circulated item the price will stay unless some noob undercuts but again if at any point that item stops showing up on the market due to server resets and stuff the auction starts again from default, or another price unless person selling puts it up for the same undercut price.... hope you can understand what I'm trying to explain lol

[Solfleur]

I kind of wanted more of DDO type auction, heard WoW had similar one but better features.
... lol

This game has been WoW-ized too much as it is. If people are so in love with WoW, play WoW, but leave FF alone...please.

[Reinheart]

This game has been WoW-ized too much as it is. If people are so in love with WoW, play WoW, but leave FF alone...please.

Sorry but I never played WoW and don't think I ever will since I can't stand WoW's character designs, and I played FFXI and liked it a lot but I'm not as much of a fan boy as you I guess played it for at least 8 years, it was a good game but it had lots of flaws.

Now only reason I brought up WoW is because I have played DDO and I liked that auction system and heard from friends in FFXI that WoW system is much better version of it.

WoW-ized to much... LMAO more like trying to become like a good successful MMO imo.
I would pay to play WoW if it had FFXIV/Japanese style art/graphics.

[Blarp]

Every MMO should just copy and paste EVE Online's market system. It is, by far, the most comprehensive economy I've ever seen in an MMO. It is truly amazing the amount of information you can gather, and understanding/exploiting it can make you e-rich very quickly. I really see no problem with economic manipulation, but I understand the concern. I will say that it takes far more patience, dedication, and risk to participate in economic PVP than going into an instance and slaying a dragon. You can literally risk everything and become massively wealthy overnight, or lose everything you've worked for in a few hours.

[zaviermhigo]

I'm all for price transparency and blah blah blah, but I put up my crap on my retainer before I go to bed, and by the time I wake up in the morning, nothing has sold because people decided to undercut 4k or more less. I'm not talking about materia and crap, I'm talking gathered items and such. Inflation is a problem, but you guys also forget deflation isn't healthy either, then no one can make money, not even people who just want to get on and sell a few things.

[Roaran]

With such a limited history, goods can be repeatedly bought and sold for non-market value prices on purpose by a player or group of players in order to artificially inflate the price of a particular good.

For example:

Say an Iron Axe is normally sold at the wards for about 10,000 gil. Anyone checking the price history could see that the past 20 axes have been sold for around 10,000 gil. However, I come in and repeatedly buy and sell the axe using a friend or an alt for 25,000 gil 20 times. I then list all my Iron Axes for sale at 25,000 and any new buyers and sellers looking at the price history think that the axe is worth 25,000 gil when it really isn't.

This was somewhat of a problem in FF11, and it can potentially be a problem in FF14.


This is better than the FF11 auction house because the ambiguous "auction" part of the transaction is eliminated, which cuts out another avenue for price manipulation due to customer ignorance.

There's one problem with this. When someone sells axes at 10,000 gil, that is the price the producer/supplier is willing to sell at. If there are 10 axes, and 15 people willing to purchase the axes, the price is low. Ten players will benefit from the lower price, and 5 people will lose out. Some of those 5 people may have valued those axes at a higher price, and would have been willing to pay a higher price. The supplier is the one who is ignorant of their customers, and because of this, some of the axes go to the players who 'got there first' rather than the players who valued them the most.

When a player purchases these axes and then bids the price up, they are actually ensuring that those axes first go to those players who place the highest value on them. And by doing so, actually help facilitate the economy.

In a free market, NO ABUSE CAN TAKE PLACE. Because the transactions are all voluntary, you can simply avoid purchasing. If, for example, there's only one axe available for your level and you absolutely need it to continue, then rather than being gouged, the person buying and bidding up the prices is actually helping you by ensuring that noone who places a lesser value on the axes purchases them before you. If the price is too high for anyone, then the person bidding up items might lose gil, so there is a built-in incentive to prevent that.

Price histories can be both good and bad. But they can't be abused in a free market. The good is, you can see in the past how much something was worth and you can make a decision on whether to buy now or wait. They can be bad, because it can alter the perception of some people and promote more arbitrary prices instead, as it does not reflect current circumstances of the market. An example would be, one of the main crafters of a server is very effecient at producing axes and has mass produced them at a low price for several months. Suddenly he quits, and now the only remaining crafters available cannot make the item for so low. Naturally the price should rise, but the price history would make players less likely to purchase at the new value, and would also prevent some crafters from supplying at the new value.

[Solfleur]

In a free market, NO ABUSE CAN TAKE PLACE. Because the transactions are all voluntary, you can simply avoid purchasing.

Apparently you weren't a victim of the inflation/deflation cycle in FFXI.

Well perhaps victim is a bit strong, but it wasn't fun either. Full disclosure is the ONLY way to go or it accomplishes nothing. A free market means an open market with access to ALL buy/sell information, which is why I tore my hair out at the beginning of U.S. beta testing because we didn't have an AH or mail delivery system (and got flamed to hell and gone for it too).

Guess I wasn't so stupid after all. Now if I can just get them to back up off the bastardization of the game via even more WoW-ing up to please the tweener masses, and I may just stick around and play this thing through until they crash and burn or end up with a playable game. My curiosity is beginning to get the better of me...

[Roaran]

I'm all for the above idea of an average price listing, but I also liked the aspect from XI where you couldn't see exactly what the sellers put their wares up for. As is now, everyone just tries to undercut one another into oblivion

"Undercutting" is natural. It's the process by which an ever growing number of goods is capable of getting into a larger number of hands. If all the goods that were up for sale were not being under cut, you would always have a surplus, and there would always be a chunk of goods that never sells. This would potentially mean yours as well.

If you think people are pricing way too low, just buy it out and resell it. And if you aren't able to resell it, at your price, the undercutter actually had the correct price and your's was too high.

Apparently you weren't a victim of the inflation/deflation cycle in FFXI.

Well perhaps victim is a bit strong, but it wasn't fun either. Full disclosure is the ONLY way to go or it accomplishes nothing. A free market means an open market with access to ALL buy/sell information, which is why I tore my hair out at the beginning of U.S. beta testing because we didn't have an AH or mail delivery system (and got flamed to hell and gone for it too).

Guess I wasn't so stupid after all. Now if I can just get them to back up off the bastardization of the game via even more WoW-ing up to please the tweener masses, and I may just stick around and play this thing through until they crash and burn or end up with a playable game. My curiosity is beginning to get the better of me...

I don't really see how you could have an 'inflation/deflation cycle' in an MMO unless, with each update, the developers continually tweak the money supply. Which has sort of happened in FFXIV. They just reduced the rate at which currency was entering the economy. It's hard to tell if there was really any inflation, because you would also need to know the number of goods that currency was being used to purchase.

Prices can go up and down due to supply and demand; this is not inflation. Price histories do not reflect supply and demand unless they show extremely long trends. And in the end, price is determined by the value placed on the item by the purchasers and the price suppliers are willing to bring that item to market: i.e. if someone is 'gouging' prices and people are still willing to purchase at that price, then the market is still perfectly fine. Items should go to those who place the highest value on an item.

[Scherwiz]

Apparently you weren't a victim of the inflation/deflation cycle in FFXI.

Well perhaps victim is a bit strong, but it wasn't fun either. Full disclosure is the ONLY way to go or it accomplishes nothing. A free market means an open market with access to ALL buy/sell information, which is why I tore my hair out at the beginning of U.S. beta testing because we didn't have an AH or mail delivery system (and got flamed to hell and gone for it too).

Guess I wasn't so stupid after all. Now if I can just get them to back up off the bastardization of the game via even more WoW-ing up to please the tweener masses, and I may just stick around and play this thing through until they crash and burn or end up with a playable game. My curiosity is beginning to get the better of me...

Good luck, because if Yoshi looked at the XI auction house at all he probably said no thanks.

[Jinko]

I agree that its a mistake for the development team to add something similar to FF11, they should be looking more at how WoW's system works, no price history (unless you use addons) and you have to compete againts what is currently being sold.

It's kind of similar to the marketwards with much much better search features and functionality.

Part of me is happy for price history because now at least I know as a buyer if im being ripped off and as a seller know what to sell an item for.

Problem is as someone else said a large price history will have a downward spiral effect on the price of items until they are no longer viable to make money on.

Really sad they thought FF11's AH was the best choice to copy, why is it SE can't look at other games to get idea's, FF11 is 10 years old for crying out loud !!