The Mentoring Requirements... *Rant Style*

[Odett]

You didn't answer me.

I will try again...How do any of the mechanics brought forth in HW endgame come into play in the first 40 hours of gameplay? Adding people to friends list and linkshell will occur regardless of the mentor system...so why should these mechanics matter for a mentor, specifically?

Because for the people that will use the mentor system for more than achievements, it's not far-fetched at all to imagine that they'll keep in contact with the people that they were mentoring. I am aware that it counts regardless, but having the mentor system will make it much easier for people seeking help to see who those willing to help are, so it's not outside the bounds of possibility that some of these players will ask questions about things that can happen outside their 40 hour green-leaf period. Being a lv 60 in every role will better suit the mentor in order to answer such questions.

Think of it like this, if you were designing a mentor system, would you make the requirements something that barely gives potential mentors the tools to get by and answer questions in very broad and vague terms, or make the requirements a little tougher in order to better improve the odds that a mentor can answer any question pertaining to a role? I am aware that being a level 60 in no way makes you an expert, but it's the minimum requirement for you to be an expert. I'm not sure I'm wording this as best as I can, so my apologies for that, but when you see a lv 60 player, there are 2 possibilities: they can either be really good at their job and be able to explain specific questions, or they can't, as opposed to seeing a lv 30 player, where the answer automatically becomes the latter.

Moreover, I mentioned in a previous post how it's very rare to see people who play all 3 roles have just one of each (one tank, one DPS, and one healer), and more often than not, (or every time, to be honest, I've yet to see a person who chose to play all 3 roles just have one of each at least 6 months after a level cap increase), making that a requirement greatly heightens the odds that a mentor can answer a more job-specific question, as people who have one of each role at 60 have higher odds of having other jobs at 60 as well.

What I'm trying to get at is that a lot of players are failing to see the mentor system, or rather, what might happen after the first 40 hours, and the development team more than likely saw that coming and decided to implement requirements that will make a mentor much more capable in helping others during their green leaf period, and after as well.

[Toguro]

Then at that point they get to join a linkshell or FC with multiple people that probably have that same job to teach them exactly, in detail, what they need to know. No shame in multiple teachers pitching in to help one student. That'll be more productive.

[Odett]

1. You proved my point, by stating you meet the requirements of the mentor system and having the same knowledge on how to customize your set up. The same knowledge I have, as a player who doesn't meet the requirements.

Except, you know, I meet the requirements and you don't, so that's a pretty big difference. Your argument would only make sense if you were the only person that didn't meet the mentor requirements and knew of these things, and that's something you're repeatedly failing to grasp.

2. The system is for basics not end game rotations, raids or fc recruiting or end game tactics. It's for basics.

So if a newbie asks you how their role behaves at endgame, because some people want to see how their job plays at lv 60 to see if they like it or not, before spending time leveling something they'll later realize they're not going to like, how can you possibly answer from first-hand experience if you don't have a tank, DPS, and healer at 60? Oh, right, you can't.

3. You only have 40 hours to be apart of that linkshell you're not holding their hand up to HW so everything in 3.0 is irrelevant.

So you'll just stop talking to the people you helped after their 40 hour period, and they won't ask you questions as they continue the leveling process?

4. SE is tethering rewards to the system after the release. Please explain how it is selfish to want rewards for helping out when the company that is making the system is giving out rewards for that reason.

A kind or selfless act is done out of the wanting of doing said act for another person, not because you expect a reward for it. You don't take someone out to dinner and then expect that they owe you something after, I mean, well, you can, but that would make you a crappy person.

[Odett]

Then at that point they get to join a linkshell or FC with multiple people that probably have that same job to teach them exactly, in detail, what they need to know. No shame in multiple teachers pitching in to help one student. That'll be more productive.

Or the situation can be avoided in the first place by having that same person keep on teaching them. The fact that you said this shows a huge flaw in your argument and just how important it is to have each role at 60 as a mentor, because with the example you have yourself provided, you've reached your capabilities as a mentor, and could have kept helping them had you met the current requirements.

As a true newbie to this game and MMOs, it took a month for me to get level 23. I remember getting killed by Lazy Laurence. Wish I had a mentor

and it took me less than that, in 2.0 where main scenario quests gave half the experience they do now, when there was no challenge log to give you bonus experience, and there was no daily "leveling roulette", to hit 50. You can't base your experience around everyone else because others will either level much faster, or much slower than you did.

[BlatantPyre]

<last couple o' posts>

Your point is well taken, Odett. None of what you said I disagree with. I have not been against the lvl 60 requirement, in fact I understand the same logic that you see in it's implementation. That being said, the notion that knowledge of endgame mechanics should be necessary for a mentor is simply not true. The idea that the mentor system will be a springboard for future in-game relationships is true, and precisely one of the problems many who are locked out of this system are having a problem with: they will be alienated to a degree at this point. Now, I agree, if someone wants to become a mentor, earn the requirements; I never said otherwise. Certain peoples playstyles, chosen playstyles, may bar them from that, and that's just how it is. I'm not okay with that, but I can't complain about it either, not really, because requirements are needed, and no matter what they are, someone will be locked out of it simply because of how they choose to play, it's unavoidable. What I AM trying to get at is that having the requirements be lvl 50 instead will still have a desired effect in rooting out those who don't understand the role-system: HW mechanics are not required for this. Yes, people might ask questions about current endgame content, but that isn't the purpose of the mentoring system - it's to learn the basics of the MMO genre and how they come into play in FFXIV. Should people who are fully capable of properly teaching such things, who have a desire to help people and have the skill and knowledge to back it up, not be able to do so simply because they haven't spent the money for an expansion?

[Evangela]

Oh man... if you spend all these times working on the requirements you're lacking, you should've made everything ready before 3.2, but no, you just spent your time complaining and arguing with people on the forum.

[Reisui]

1. You proved my point, by stating you meet the requirements of the mentor system and having the same knowledge on how to customize your set up. The same knowledge I have, as a player who doesn't meet the requirements.

Just go and level you're healer to meet the requirements, it's not really that hard to get to 60

2. The system is for basics not end game rotations, raids or fc recruiting or end game tactics. It's for basics.

3. You only have 40 hours to be apart of that linkshell you're not holding their hand up to HW so everything in 3.0 is irrelevant.

Nothing stops you to help a newbie, even if you're not an 'official' mentor.

By making contact with those players, you will probably make friends, and thus you still could help them till HW and beyond (I already made a LS to invite those players in)

4. SE is tethering rewards to the system after the release. Please explain how it is selfish to want rewards for helping out when the company that is making the system is giving out rewards for that reason.

The rewards are a bonus, but you should never do it for that, you become a mentor because you want to help the people, be it with or without reward

[Legion88]

So, everyone here ranting about the reqirements seems to not see the whole picture.
Ther requirements are not only for the mentoring site, they are also for the roulette bound to the system.

1k dungeon clears means you have played a lot of time, so you should be experienced in the game.
300 commendations means you are not a complete jerk.

1 out of each role at 60 means multiple things:
- you should be done with leveling in havensward aka you are in the actual content
- you have a proven way to say "I know all the spectrums of the basics of the trinity and the game itself"
- speculation: The roulette will say which role you have to pick to join

It is just a level requirement like all other content in this game.

[Odett]

Your point is well taken, Odett. None of what you said I disagree with. I have not been against the lvl 60 requirement, in fact I understand the same logic that you see in it's implementation. That being said, the notion that knowledge of endgame mechanics should be necessary for a mentor is simply not true. The idea that the mentor system will be a springboard for future in-game relationships is true, and precisely one of the problems many who are locked out of this system are having a problem with: they will be alienated to a degree at this point. Now, I agree, if someone wants to become a mentor, earn the requirements; I never said otherwise. Certain peoples playstyles, chosen playstyles, may bar them from that, and that's just how it is. I'm not okay with that, but I can't complain about it either, not really, because requirements are needed, and no matter what they are, someone will be locked out of it simply because of how they choose to play, it's unavoidable. What I AM trying to get at is that having the requirements be lvl 50 instead will still have a desired effect in rooting out those who don't understand the role-system: HW mechanics are not required for this. Yes, people might ask questions about current endgame content, but that isn't the purpose of the mentoring system - it's to learn the basics of the MMO genre and how they come into play in FFXIV. Should people who are fully capable of properly teaching such things, who have a desire to help people and have the skill and knowledge to back it up, not be able to do so simply because they haven't spent the money for an expansion?

I mostly agree with you. It's true that some players may experience some level of alienation from this, but it's not like they're banned either from being a mentor should they not meet the requirements from day one. I get that the main point of the mentor system is not to teach endgame, but that still won't stop new people from asking what their job in endgame will be like. Unfortunately, you do need to spend money for the expansion in order to answer such questions, and having a level 60 might make it possible that you'll be able to meet their question with an appropriate answer, whereas only getting to lv 50 will guarantee that your answer will be "I don't know". Again, it's better from a developer's standpoint to make requirements where it is possible for the mentor to answer as many questions as possible in regards to role performance, responsibilities, and toolkits, than to make requirements lax enough to guarantee that some of these questions will go unanswered.

[Toguro]

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I agree I said exactly this repeatedly in this thread. That it would be way better to have it at 50.

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If they are asking about lv60 end-game content in something(which is absolutely possible), then maybe they need to go somewhere else for help? That's like you're in 1st Grade and you ask about college stuff. You're asking in the wrong place. And also, you're teacher may not know!

and it took me less than that, in 2.0 where main scenario quests gave half the experience they do now, when there was no challenge log to give you bonus experience, and there was no daily "leveling roulette", to hit 50. You can't base your experience around everyone else because others will either level much faster, or much slower than you did.

I started in November 2014. I didn't know about any of the bonus experience, the importance of leveling roulette.. actually pretty much everything that had to do with getting more exp.