About Plot selling

[Ilitsa]

snip

I wish I could like your post more than once.

So, according to some people on this thread, if a dude with a private house wants to do a server transfer, he has three choices:
- Wait 45 days for the reclaim system to kick in,
- Transfer immediatly and lose everything,
- Transfer immediatly and get banned because he sold his plot to someone else.

In short terms, no matter what, that guy is screwed.

Shhh it doesn't matter if house owners get screwed, so long as THEY get what THEY want in the end! To think otherwise makes US greedy!

[Lexia]

In these cases the players selling the plot do not WANT to price gouge other players, they simply want to get back the gil they invested. You cannot blame people for that.

Investment in what? The plot itself or all the stuff you put in the house? I can see people wanting the gil back they paid for the house but all the stuff they put into the house take it with you, what you can cause I know some stuff can't or don't. Don't try to pass that off the the person you trying to sell the give up rights to cause you not giving them all those items also.

[Bourne_Endeavor]

So, according to some people on this thread, if a dude with a private house wants to do a server transfer, he has three choices:
- Wait 45 days for the reclaim system to kick in,
- Transfer immediatly and lose everything,
- Transfer immediatly and get banned because he sold his plot to someone else.

In short terms, no matter what, that guy is screwed.

I doubt you would receive any sort of punishment if you sold your house at or around market value. I believe the default price was 4M for a small house? So if you PF'd that, you can easily justify you simply want to upgrade or transfer servers. What SE is against is players attempting gouge others by selling plots for exorbitant prices or purposely buying multiple plots via alts.

[Mael-bess]

It does make you greedy when you're trying to get back the gil you invested in something that's not even meant to be profitable, but something to sink money in and maintain for a long term, it's rather expected to you will loose money when getting rid of it, this is exactly like real life housing,

The problem here is SE housing system as it is;

-Houses should be account wide (able to be accessed from all your characters)
-Only 1 house should be allowed per player
-You should be able to switch houses more easily (like when you buy a new plot, your old one get's demolished and you get a discount in the new one)
-You should be able to demolish your house if you want to, without waiting 45 days

House selling by players shouldn't be allowed anyway, it creates a bad market.

[Lunaxia]

I hope people who hoard more than one house for themselves or who try to sell a small plot for 15 mil step on lego.

[Bourne_Endeavor]

It does make you greedy when you're trying to get back the gil you invested in something that's not even meant to be profitable, but something to sink money in and maintain for a long term, it's rather expected to you will loose money when getting rid of it, this is exactly like real life housing,

The problem here is SE housing system as it is;

-Houses should be account wide (able to be accessed from all your characters)
-Only 1 house should be allowed per player
-You should be able to switch houses more easily (like when you buy a new plot, your old one get's demolished and you get a discount in the new one)
-You should be able to demolish your house if you want to, without waiting 45 days

House selling by players shouldn't be allowed anyway, it creates a bad market.

No offense, but have you ever heard of house flipping in real life? The potential mark up on real estate ventures is extraordinary if you have the available cash to gamble the market. Purchase a fixer up at a fraction of the cost, have construction done and resell it sometime thereafter. You can turn a profit several thousand beyond your initial investment. That is not greed-- just simple economics. People wanting a return on their investment in-game is comparable to the aforementioned. Granted, most go well above making a little profit or merely wanting to recoup their losses. While I agree with your solution, as it stands, you're demanding a lot of people to essentially give up millions of gil under the current system.

[Niwashi]

• The 80% refund and your stuff being reclaimable should apply when you relinquish a house, without needing to wait for the 45 day automatic version.
• When you relinquish a house, there should be a random interval (perhaps anywhere between 1 and 72 hours) before the plot goes back up on the market. This lowers the value of information about relinquishing it, discouraging the type of "selling" currently leading to hoarding problems.
• Resident Caretaker should store stuff indefinitely. There's no reason for that to be a limited time feature, and limiting it just encourages people to keep houses they're no longer using because otherwise they'd need to find a place to put their housing stuff until they're ready to buy another.
• The furnishings etc. that you get back should include all items from the house without that stupid rule about some not being reclaimable. (Again, not only is it more fair that way and allow for things like redecorating, but loss of them encourages people keeping houses they aren't using.)
• When you buy a personal house, it should become the personal house of all alts on that account on that server. All alts would have full ownership privileges, but be unable to buy other personal houses without relinquishing the first one. (This would change who can have a house. I'd propose that the current rule about needing to be level 50 and 2nd Lt apply just to the character who makes the purchase, but not be needed for other alts using it. Another alternative would be that other alts only gain full ownership rights (decorating, use of gardens, stables, etc.) once they, too, meet the requirements.)

That last one (though it would have been a good rule to set in the first place) would be the hardest to add at this point, just because they'd need a way to deal with all the accounts that currently have multiple houses. There's no obvious way to determine which of them the player would keep as their account-wide personal house. All the other changes listed should be relatively straightforward to add, though, and would be helpful even without that last one.

[Kosmos992k]

Pretty sure buying up plots and reselling them for obscenely high prices has gotten a few people in trouble.

If someone's doing it repeatedly, just start reporting them every time they put up a PF or shout about it.

Indeed, Someone posted a complaint topic about this recently because they felt unfairly disciplined, because they sold their plot (that they had bought genuinely, but never had time to actually use.

Personally though, I feel that if you bought a plot and subsequently realize you can't use it, then relinquish it. In fact, since SE is giving absentee land lords 80% of their investment back, I don't think it's too unfair to suggest that when players relinquish their plot of land back to the system they should get some proportion of their investment back, perhaps 60% rather than 80% since they don't have to wait 45 days. That might help control the plot reselling via PF. Certainly it would remove one of the excuses people use to justify gouging players for a plot of land.

Oh, just noticed Niwashi's suggestion above, and I agree, but would reduce the returned gil to 60% because you don't have to wait for 45 days.

When you buy a personal house, it should become the personal house of all alts on that account on that server. All alts would have full ownership privileges, but be unable to buy other personal houses without relinquishing the first one. (This would change who can have a house. I'd propose that the current rule about needing to be level 50 and 2nd Lt apply just to the character who makes the purchase, but not be needed for other alts using it. Another alternative would be that other alts only gain full ownership rights (decorating, use of gardens, stables, etc.) once they, too, meet the requirements.)

Yes, this would be excellent, and the system needs to be able to allow players to own one 'personal' house and one Free Company house, since otherwise FC masters are screwed.

That last one (though it would have been a good rule to set in the first place) would be the hardest to add at this point, just because they'd need a way to deal with all the accounts that currently have multiple houses. There's no obvious way to determine which of them the player would keep as their account-wide personal house. All the other changes listed should be relatively straightforward to add, though, and would be helpful even without that last one.

It could be done by messaging the player, ask the payer to choose which home they want to keep, refund 100% of the gil spend on the others, and store all related furnishings with the residential Caretaker indefinitely for the player to recover.

[Waeksyn]

It's ridiculous that the only way to recoup any investment in a house is to wait 45 days (without entering). While this released a backlog of inactive plots, it does nothing to ease the ongoing housing shortage. It's also the direct reason for the wave of flipping.

Eorzea needs a real estate brokerage! List your property for sale! The broker takes a fee (removes gil from the game) of 20%. Once you list, you cannot delist and the system starts a reverse auction, lowering the price (like it does for new plot sales) until it sells.

[Alberel]

There's no in-game system to sell your house. The closest thing is the 45 day reclaim, and that's been recent. When you bought your house you did so with the expectation of having no recourse to get that investment back. It is a sunk cost. Now you can even let it idle for 45 days and get 80% back. That's great. Do that.

I'd be for adding a "i want to demolish my house now" button for the 80%, since it's there already. Why force people trying to transfer servers to idle 45 days? Before that system was added, though, I would have said that wanting any money back for it at all is entitled.

To be fair selling houses was A-OK back when housing first launched so people were buying in the knowledge that they could recoup some of that gil from another player if they decided to give up the plot. It's only since the auto-demolish disaster that the GMs reversed their stance on the issue due to so many people buying purely to resell.

Investment in what? The plot itself or all the stuff you put in the house? I can see people wanting the gil back they paid for the house but all the stuff they put into the house take it with you, what you can cause I know some stuff can't or don't. Don't try to pass that off the the person you trying to sell the give up rights to cause you not giving them all those items also.

I'm talking purely about the gil invested in buying the plot. Most furnishings and such you can take with you so I doubt many people are even factoring that in.