Tanks using their enmity combo while being OT

[Galgarion]

A better WAR OT uses consecutive Storm's Eye combos if they're anywhere close to pulling aggro, instead of mindlessly rotating SE->BB, because the 20 potency the WAR loses by dropping from BB to SE is absolutely dwarved by the 60-80 potency that the DRK or PLD MT gains by upgrading from RoH/PS to Del/DA SE/RA.

W-what? Contribute to the raid? Playing like a support class? Are you some kind of c-c-c-communist?!

All joking aside, this thread has become a pretty damning indictment of the DPS IS GOD mentality. The idea of contributing to the group for a minuscule sacrifice in potency has got people hissing "baaaaad," as though to do such a thing would be unthinkable. Tunnel vision.

[Ultimatecalibur]

A competent healer isn't going to notice a 2000 damage attack hitting for 1800. I have never seen a difference between a tank using storm's path and one not when it comes to damage taken, nor have I ever noticed an appreciable difference as a tank in the amount of damage in taking. If my Storm's Path is causing that Much of a dps increase in a situation where only the MT is being hit, they seriously need to learn how to use cooldowns. At that point it's a DPS increase for me to take over.

They may not notice the single hits, but the good healers do notice when it takes 5 rather than 4 attacks to knock the tank below half hp as it gives them time to do another attack before healing the MT up.

[Kotemon]

I rather tanks use enmity combos every so often over pure dps for the sake of not seeing the MT die and the boss heads over to the mage or one of the healers because OT isn't a warrior in the top 3 of the boss' to do list. With that said if OT in pure dps mode with no enmity combos is fighting hate, then MT should let it go and switch to OT. The only time to complain is when said OT is in tank stance the whole time. Remember if the MT dies should it go to the healer/mage/dps roam or to the next tank. But since OT is a warrior its more or less due to it being their better dps rotations. The next question to this would be, how many warriors are present and are any ninjas involved? In theory one warrior could do Path and the other Eye. But ninjas also have a slashing debuff and does it matter if warrior OT and ninja both use their slashing debuff?

[NovaLevossida]

I haven't tanked since first Coil back at launch, but I strongly remember having to avoid using Butcher's Block combos at times to avoid ripping hate off the PLD. He had gotten his (myth? been a long time) body piece first while I spent tomes on a Bravura. It only took one moment of ripping hate off of him to cause a wipe and after that I always watched my enmity.

I get the "it's less DPS if I don't" mentality, but let's be honest here. It's a net DPS loss for the group if your pulling hate off the main tank adversely affects the group, and most of the time it will. But that's just normal with this game compared to XI: 14's spam all your abilities as fast as you can and if something goes wrong it's the fault of the guy not giving 110% vs. 11's feeling out enmity levels and holding back on your DPS so you don't rip hate off the tank. I get that you shouldn't have to in 14 if everything is played optimally, but if everything were going optimally you'd never ever wipe in this game either. I live in (and try to adjust my play to) the practical world however.

[Jpec07]

Nothing quite like getting that level 50 trial on my 204 PLD and tearing off the WAR or DRK MT while I'm in Sword Oath and Str gear when I pop Fight or Flight, because my Rage of Halone combo is literally the only thing I have to work with.

Though I suppose being a good player means knowing not only how to hit the throttle, but when not to.

So to that end, I suppose I could open with a few Riot Blade combos instead, just to let the MT get a hate lead.

[Fyce]

A bad war puts up Storm's Path, it lowers dps by a significant margin. A good war OT uses Butcher's block to keep up high DPS.

Storm's Path is always an objective DPS loss.

Be a good tank.

Don't use Path.

You litteraly said "ignoring everything about group synergy is being a good tank".

Everytime a MT (DRK/PLD) have to use an enmity combo to keep up with the OT WAR's Butcher's block, the group loses overall potency.
Even if you use Storm's Path instead of BB, if it allow the MT to use a single DPS rotation instead of an enmity one, the whole group's potency will increase.


... But who cares, right? Be a good Tank, yay.

[SpookyGhost]

*slides in*

Path is situational - in any situation where you Path'd, you could've Eye'd or Block'd. Path doesn't provide enough healer GCDs generally for it to be worth keeping up consistently at the damage loss you take on top of the fact that said extra healer GCDs can miss. Path, however, is good for AOEs, tank busters, etc.

Usually people think that it's either Eye -> BB or Eye -> Path, however there is another path you can take called Eye -> Eye - which is only a 20 potency loss. So if you don't need Path and you fear you're creeping too much on the aggro ladder, just Eye -> Eye.

*slides out*

[Tint]

i have a bit trouble with warriors too. i understand why they use the aggro combo and yes they should use it for more damage. but i just started tanking. so i am a fresh dark knight and i find it a bit tricky to not run out of mana while keeping the aggro when there is a war ot ^^;

[Galgarion]

i have a bit trouble with warriors too. i understand why they use the aggro combo and yes they should use it for more damage. but i just started tanking. so i am a fresh dark knight and i find it a bit tricky to not run out of mana while keeping the aggro when there is a war ot ^^;

Use shadow skin, turn grit off, activate blood weapon. No mo mana problems.

[Lyth]

I think that they were referring to MP issues while tight for enmity. Which is reasonable; the more PS combos you're forced into, the less MP you have at your disposal because you lose SS. Turning off Grit is only an option if you have a reasonable lead. This becomes less of an issue with better gear, however.