Required Class/Rank failed - Can we have Optimal Rank and Favoured Class back?

[AamesxDavid]

How can we have a real discussion when your Group 2 were nothing but whiners who don't approve of other peoples gear??

I was being honest, and stated that I was open to correction. Your response was evidently a purposely exaggerated example in the other direction. I'm sorry if I can't see how I'm the childish one in this exchange.

I stated that I was simply in favour of the freedom that the optimal system provides - a far cry from your ignorant Group 2.

Yet my Group 2 was against the optimal system for no other reason than the disapproval of people wearing inappropriate gear, and instead of provide a counter to that, you provided a strawman - intentionally, it seems. You obviously thought my group organization was a strawman, yet you gave no reason why.

I'm honestly still open for discussion on that, though I doubt you'll believe that.

[Aleczan]

And the purpose of that restriction?

So that not everyone looks identical?

This is just me and my fashion preference, but I find it so wrong to have universal equipment which do not restrict anything at all, albeit level or class. I like how my Miner & Fisher, Culinarian & Carpenter, Pugilist, Conjurer, and Lancer all look different and distinguished from each other. I also like how I see other person and be able to guess their class or class type at first glance. Without gear restriction, it would be so monotonous and boring. It's just natural that different classes has different array of available armors. It's against my common sense and fashion sense to think that an Archer or Pugilist should be able to wear heavy armor or plated armor just like Marauder or Gladiator. So I don't see anything wrong with having restriction.

Also, I am not saying that having optimal level system was bad. It's just that it is not that bad to change over. You can't tailor the game to fit everyone's preference and/or convenience. But currently I (and many people) see that there's already a game mechanism that's helping you deal with the "inconvenience" in the game (in this case, Macro, my greatest helper ever since before they implemented Action Bar saving for each class,) so the point most people (or at least the OP) are complaining about (stripping naked when change class) is just a trivial problem and can be easily worked out with some effort.

[AamesxDavid]

So that not everyone looks identical?

I wish I could say that I understand this fear.. but I don't. Since when does a lack of restriction on gear mean everyone will wear the same thing always, regardless of class or level? If these people care about stats (which most people do), they'll wear the optimal gear anyhow.

I find it so wrong to have universal equipment which do not restrict anything at all

Same thing here - it's not actually universal because it's for specific classes. It simply doesn't require them.

I like how my Miner & Fisher, Culinarian & Carpenter, Pugilist, Conjurer, and Lancer all look different and distinguished from each other.

Right, they do even with the optimal system if you're wearing the proper gear. Anyway, you get the idea.

It's just that it is not that bad to change over.

And I'm not saying this is game-breaking or anything like that, just that it's an unnecessary change that does have downsides. And, most importantly, no real upsides, because all of the concerns I've heard about the optimal system either aren't true, aren't legitimate, or can be taken care of without abandoning the whole system for a required one.

[ellohwell]

So that not everyone looks identical?

This is just me and my fashion preference, but I find it so wrong to have universal equipment which do not restrict anything at all, albeit level or class. I like how my Miner & Fisher, Culinarian & Carpenter, Pugilist, Conjurer, and Lancer all look different and distinguished from each other. I also like how I see other person and be able to guess their class or class type at first glance. Without gear restriction, it would be so monotonous and boring. It's just natural that different classes has different array of available armors. It's against my common sense and fashion sense to think that an Archer or Pugilist should be able to wear heavy armor or plated armor just like Marauder or Gladiator. So I don't see anything wrong with having restriction.

Also, I am not saying that having optimal level system was bad. It's just that it is not that bad to change over. You can't tailor the game to fit everyone's preference and/or convenience. But currently I (and many people) see that there's already a game mechanism that's helping you deal with the "inconvenience" in the game (in this case, Macro, my greatest helper ever since before they implemented Action Bar saving for each class,) so the point most people (or at least the OP) are complaining about (stripping naked when change class) is just a trivial problem and can be easily worked out with some effort.

Restriction is what makes everyone look the same.

Do you honestly not realise that?

[Tsuga]

Yeah, the break down of the groups is incorrect.

Group 1: You have a group who likes having defined gear for classes, with restrictions based on class or level. It makes sense to them and they have no problem purchasing or crafting the appropriate gear for the current level of whatever class they are playing.

Group 2: You have another group who wants to purchase one set of gear and use it for all of their classes ad-infinium, until they can replace it with r50 gear for the appropriate class. They seem ignorant to the fact that now, stats DO matter.

I'm all ears for arguments as to why we should cater the system to Group 2.

That or there are people in group 3, who want gear to be cross class/level so that they can look pretty - to which I say don't keep the convoluted favor system, just implement an aesthetics tab.

The bottom line is that stats DO matter now. Not wearing gear near your level nerfs your gear, just like you were nerfed when you weren't wearing favored gear. The problem is that with favored gear, sometimes you don't realize you're wearing the wrong gear (could be you just switched classes, and left something out of a macro, or you just can't tell that there is better gear out there for your rank because the favoring system is so unclear), or you go searching in the market, and it is not clear to you what is best for your rank/class, because there are five different things that are near your level that favor your class, but really only one is optimal (this happens mostly with DoH and DoL). There is also the fact that it is much easier for the devs to balance combat, and gear with the class and stat restrictions.

Which is easier to understand at a glance:

Belt A: (requires: gladiator level 30. Str +5 Dex +3)

Belt B: (Favors: Gladiator, Pugilist, Botonist, Weaver Suggested level: 30. Str +5 Magical Defense +3 Gathering +3)

Combine this with the fact that there are 3-4 other belts that suggest the same or a similar level, that also are recommended for your class, and 4 other seemingly random classes.

Picking gear should be as simple as "I'm level 30, I'm a gladiator, I want gear that's for a level 30 gladiator". There could be more options for people who are interested in stat crunching, which we have with Materia and the rare NM/chest drops.

[AamesxDavid]

sometimes you don't realize you're wearing the wrong gear (could be you just switched classes, and left something out of a macro, or you just can't tell that there is better gear out there for your rank because the favoring system is so unclear)

Which, as I've said before, isn't a reason for getting rid of the optimal system, but simply making it clearer.

Which is easier to understand at a glance:

Belt A: (requires: gladiator level 30. Str +5 Dex +3)

Belt B: (Favors: Gladiator, Pugilist, Botonist, Weaver Suggested level: 30. Str +5 Magical Defense +3 Gathering +3)

I'll see your heavily-biased examples and raise you a more balanced one:

Belt C: (Favors: Gladiator Suggested level: 30. Str + 5 Dex +3)

Does this not suit your:

"I'm level 30, I'm a gladiator, I want gear that's for a level 30 gladiator"

Now, I wouldn't be surprised if right now you're asking "well then what's the point?" And in a preemptive response to that, I ask "If this is how the favored system worked, what would be the point of changing it to required?"

[Tsuga]

Which, as I've said before, isn't a reason for getting rid of the optimal system, but simply making it clearer.

And how would you propose they make it more clear? A tutorial, for picking gear? That should come as naturally as "I kill a monster, I get exp". It should not require a tutorial.

I'll see your heavily-biased examples and raise you a more balanced one:

Belt C: (Favors: Gladiator Suggested level: 30. Str + 5 Dex +3)

Most (all?) gear does not favor a single class, and that is part of what makes the system so unclear. There are also plenty of pieces of gear like my example.

Having restricted classes and levels prevents you from unknowingly gimping yourself. It also makes it easier for the dev team to balance how classes work in a party (it is a multiplayer game after all), materia, and how classes will progress. With tough content like Ifrit being implemented knowing what gear is good for you, and the devs being able to balance that gear are both essential.

Favored gear only benefits those who don't want to upgrade their gear regularly, and who want to look pretty. Sorry but those aren't good enough reasons to complicate a system that is self explanatory in every single other RPG.

[DantesAmore]

@ OP whine more on WoW please. Final Fantasy is not known for catering to infants. Gear Restrictions were in XI and now in XIV. both make/made perfect sense. If you dont wanna be a gimp buy/craft new gear. If you hate manually equipping gear stop being lazy and take 3mins out of your ever so busy day and make a macro like the smart people do .... macro swap or no swap ftw! haha...

sorry for the blunt rude way of saying that but ... omg whine more? gets annoying i do believe this game is rated T not E and posts like the OP's seem like a 10yr old wrote it just whining that their gear is now unusable... BTW a 18 dagger on a 15 gla means your a gimp and always has lol wear optimal get the full effect its always been more beneficial even since CE launch...

[DantesAmore]

we shouldn't they should just find a game like pong and stick with it lol

and stats make ALL the difference now.. they are the big defining difference between a group that say "the ogre is hard" (we all know its a joke even more so now) and the team that goes into the raids and 35mins later is out with new Batraal stuff for giggles

[Technyze]

OPTIMAL RANK OH GAWD D:!? nooooooo make it go away