Issue with double standards with Se and defining between dps and support.

[Vlady]

I understand that SE wants to keep certain job dps low because they provide stronger support abilities and utility then other jobs but when 4 bards are in one Alex run basically nullifying the support abilities at minimum for the other 3 bards. And the most likely outcome is the support is not even needed from the difficulty level of Alex normal thus cripplying the overall dps of the bard/machinist for basically no reason. Bards no longer possess the ability to move around maintaining full rotation upkeep so this silly weaker numbers bard/machinist pull is pointless.

Please either bring the bard/machinist up to the level of other dps or give the bard/machinist the label of support so that so many lower end dps jobs are not stacked together in alliance/raids.

[Arrik]

This, unfortunately, is pretty much being seen as a non-issue at this point by SE. We have both the last "buff" to BRD/MCH expertly crafted to keep their DPS from not significantly increasing and the official word from Yoshi-P about the addition of a Support role which was basically "yeah I don't think so" to attest to that. *Maybe* as more jobs get added and it causes greater issues among any new "support" dps they add they will go about fixing it, much in the same way the 3.2 adjustments for tanks is finally being looked at.

TL;DR I log in less and less into FFXIV, with 3.2 being the last chance at finding a job I can potentially stick to. Back to Blade and Soul for now....

[Kelevra]

That's been my thinking ever since raiding Alex savage. I love Minuet and think it was a step in the right direction, but Bard should be allowed to contribute just as much dmg as the other dmg dealers....and never out done by a damn Warrior (no dps job should be out done by a tank for that matter----when played correctly).

*in b4 someone uses a2s/fflogs as a reference*

[Judge_Xero]

But.....who brings 4 Support jobs to anything that matters?

I think that that's what Yoshi P wants to eliminate happening.

In the majority of content BRD/MCH is still pretty competitive where there is a mix of AOE/Multi Target damage.

[jssanderson747]

Please either bring the bard/machinist up to the level of other dps

Bard can top dps in 2 of the 4 major raids in the game currently. For casual content, they do more than enough dps for any boss to die at a super fast pace.

[DBthaONE]

But.....who brings 4 Support jobs to anything that matters?

I think OP is referring to a DF run, rather than a static group. This is reminiscent of how SCHs were asking for SS2, not for static groups but more for DF groups when you don't have a choice of the other players you're paired with.

[Arrik]

But.....who brings 4 Support jobs to anything that matters?

I think that that's what Yoshi P wants to eliminate happening.

In the majority of content BRD/MCH is still pretty competitive where there is a mix of AOE/Multi Target damage.

Yes, people in pre-made parties limit the number of support dps they bring, but:

1) Other jobs are not as penalized for doubling up as the support dps are.
2) DF will pair multiple support dps, making content harder to catch up for people. Especially in cases where the fight just is moved there. I *believe* you still can't solo queue for Thordan but as soon as it is this will be a problem, as will any fight of moderate+ difficulty.
3) Support dps are double dipped with damage penalties: 1 for existing and another 1 for using most of their support functions.

[Kelevra]

But.....who brings 4 Support jobs to anything that matters?

I think that that's what Yoshi P wants to eliminate happening.

In the majority of content BRD/MCH is still pretty competitive where there is a mix of AOE/Multi Target damage.

...any dps composition should be viable when 'dealing damage' is the focus

some groups are ok with a Blm and Smn in the party, some are ok with any combonation of melee in the party, ppl shy away from having both a Bard and Machinist in the party (let alone 4 as the op is talkin bout--whereas 4 melee or 4 caster would be less of a problem)...and it shouldn't be that way

[Judge_Xero]

Well at least with multiple support classes you will only have 1 who takes a DPS loss.

Thordon is not a good comparison since the whole fight is multiple burst phases and lots of down time for songs so it is really good for BRD/MCH.

I guess when they release content where it is an issue it would be a concern.

[Arrik]

Well at least with multiple support classes you will only have 1 who takes a DPS loss.

Thordon is not a good comparison since the whole fight is multiple burst phases and lots of down time for songs so it is really good for BRD/MCH.

I guess when they release content where it is an issue it would be a concern.

No, you have up to 4 who all took a 10% WD loss to exist and 1 that takes the DPS loss to cast.

Edit: And as Kelevra wrote, any dps combination should be viable for any content, because the DF will stick any combination together.