The Current State of Specialist Actions

[Roth_Trailfinder]

That's exactly backwards. What's unfair is the current situation, where, for example, BSM has to cross-class so many other actions just to do a basic version of Rath's MaMa rotation that they don't have enough cross-class slots to bring in Innovation. Giving my short list of essential skills to Specialists removes that unfairness, which is rooted in some classes (like ALC) having better unique skills than other classes.

When some classes need to gain more than others, it shows two things. One, that the gain itself will not be fair (which is why your proposal is inherently unfair). Two, that the existing situation itself is unfair.

The only way to kill both of those unfair conditions is to simply gain all of the other cross class skills as part of becoming a Specialist.

To keep them from becoming *too* powerful, get rid of the current Specialist-only actions when you get rid of the Specialist-only recipe flag. Any weaver, regardless of Specialist (or lack thereof) should be able to produce any weaver-made item that there exists a recipe for.

[Silverbane]

When some classes need to gain more than others, it shows two things. One, that the gain itself will not be fair (which is why your proposal is inherently unfair). Two, that the existing situation itself is unfair.

The only way to kill both of those unfair conditions is to simply gain all of the other cross class skills as part of becoming a Specialist.

Because getting additional but redundant Name of <X>/Brand of <X> skills by specializing as an ALC is equivalent to getting Comfort Zone and Tricks of the Trade by specializing as a BSM?

I disagree.

[Roth_Trailfinder]

No, because getting the following ARE equal :
ALC - Rumination, Brand of Wind, Byregot's Blessing, Ingenuity, Brand of Fire, Ingenuity 2, Rapid Synthesis, Brand of Ice, Piece by Piece, Manipulation, Flawless Synthesis, Innovation, Waste Not, Brand of Earth, Waste Not 2, Careful Synthesis, Brand of Lightning, Careful Synthesis 2, Hasty Touch, Steady Hand 2, Reclaim
BSM : Rumination, Brand of Wind, Byregot's Blessing, Rapid Synthesis, Brand of Ice, Piece by Piece, Manipulation, Flawless Synthesis, Innovation, Waste Not, Brand of Earth, Waste Not 2, Careful Synthesis, Brand of Lightning, Careful Synthesis 2, Tricks of the Trade, Brand of Water, Comfort Zone, Hasty Touch, Steady Hand 2, Reclaim

I'm not going to type out the other 6 classes, but you get the idea. 15, 37, 50 skills. All 21. No Name skills, no Maker's Mark, no Muscle Memory, not until the level cap goes up again anyway.

[FoxyAreku]

A Specialist should not have Specialist-only recipes.

I disagree with this very strongly. It's good for the economy for everyone to have specific things only they can make, as it gives everyone something special they can sell. It may hurt people who want to be self-sufficient and make everything but as long as it's not something that's required (which, it never will be), you can just sell your specialist crafts to buy someone else's. It works out beautifully, I think.

[Roth_Trailfinder]

I disagree with this very strongly. It's good for the economy for everyone to have specific things only they can make, as it gives everyone something special they can sell. It may hurt people who want to be self-sufficient and make everything but as long as it's not something that's required (which, it never will be), you can just sell your specialist crafts to buy someone else's. It works out beautifully, I think.

Less competition means higher prices. Higher prices means goods don't move as fast, which means less profit over time. That in turn means the Specialist can buy fewer things.

Reducing the number of people who can make and then sell things hurts the economy, rather than helping it.

[Alistaire]

Less competition means higher prices. Higher prices means goods don't move as fast, which means less profit over time. That in turn means the Specialist can buy fewer things.

Reducing the number of people who can make and then sell things hurts the economy, rather than helping it.

This is only true to an extent, and one of the biggest problems in 14's market is undercutting more than necessary. Stopping the rampant and excessive undercutting may not have been a design goal of specialists, but it's certainly accomplished it.

[Roth_Trailfinder]

I would say the general population decline has done more to stop undercutting than Specialists. Since, y'know, it wasn't just crafted stuff that gets undercut all the time but everything.

[Bourne_Endeavor]

This is only true to an extent, and one of the biggest problems in 14's market is undercutting more than necessary. Stopping the rampant and excessive undercutting may not have been a design goal of specialists, but it's certainly accomplished it.

Not really. If you aim to sell an item on the market, you have little choice but to undercut, unless you're content waiting for however many items ahead of yours to move first. While specialists may shrink the overall market on specific items, it does next to nothing for undercutting. Not to mention, many omni-crafters have at least one alt, rendering the specialist limitation completely pointless.

At least Roth's idea would directly benefit people who don't want to level everything. Another possible solution would be to give percent bonuses to specialised classes. Like Soul of the Weaver allows you to HQ all weaver crafts significantly more easily. As it stands now though, the devs are competing in a hopeless battle with hardcore players. They should know by now you won't ever stop them for being exactly what they are: hardcore.

[Duuude007]

If all new master books require specialist actions from here forward...

TBH I would be cool with that. Means fewer people will be interested in the work it takes to become a true omnicrafter, and we will actually have something to trade one another.

[Katlyna]

Specialist skills and specs is a failed experiment that needs to be dropped like a smelly garbage bag.

I concur IF this game had been built GROUND UP with intentions of trading one another and having a full system involving such trade and design that would be one thing. But this is NOT eve online, and every game which has attempted such a design has failed. All current crafting limitations just result in micro-monopolies, frustration in finding rare (AKA crappy specializations) and other non fun situations.