What is the ninja's most up to date rotation?

[Zaranghae]

So basically it would be 1. DE 2. Mutilate 3. SF in rotation order?

As for TA stuff, open with suiton -> DE build up, on DE use TA -> Mutilate -> DWD -> SF build up -> Aeolian build up?

I've always opened with mutilate -> SF -> and then DE

[UBERHAXED]

So basically it would be 1. DE 2. Mutilate 3. SF in rotation order?
As for TA stuff, open with suiton -> DE build up, on DE use TA -> Mutilate -> DWD -> SF build up -> Aeolian build up?

I've always opened with mutilate -> SF -> and then DE

I would use SF before mutilate (higher potency so uptime is more valuable). As for the opener, it objective it to hit your highest potency moves (which are SF, Trick Attack/Sneak attack, Crit Raiton, and AE) under all of your buffs (Slash debuff, B4B, Vuln up (from TA), and potion). As I noted Raiton is no longer affected by slashing debuff and obviously you can't get TA under it's own debuff but the other move placements are to ensure that you get all of those moves under all the buffs. Duality cannot be used on off GCD moves like Trick Attack and Ninjustu and also does not apply DoTs twice so the highest potency move you can use it for is Aeolian Edge. In the rotation, every one of those moves will be hit under all the buffs with the exception of TA under it's own debuff. You also cannot use TA later, as you will loss the suition buff, or earlier as it will fall off before AE. Since SF is you're highest potency move (of all for that matter), you definitely want to use it when all of the buffs and debuffs are up.

[VisRalis]

I cannot find a simple stated rotation, too many mixed opinions and charts. I just want the basic excluding other abilities like BFB and IR.

OP did want a simple stated rotation... XD without getting into mixed opinions etc etc etc.
Something basic rt :P

Sorry if the rotation was too simple but since a lot commented about when to use TA and DoTs, looks like things are clear enough...?

Regarding when to use TA - well that's up to your party composition.
DRGs would like it early if they're using their jumps weaved in during their 1st combo.
Using TA after your 1st 1-2-3 combo would seems too slow for.
Early TA and Shadewalker on your tank helps them hit harder for their opener and hold aggro ahead more...etc

Yeah sometimes I like to use Mutilate as my opener (& reapply at end while TA debuff is still up) but depends on how fast of a burst opener the party wants.
Better early than late rt

[Zaranghae]

Okay I have a good idea now, I do not do consistent trained raids, so it's mostly pugs and informal dungeon runs that I do. I just still have some confusion of when to proc TA + DWD since this whole alignment of skills is off GCD which can be stressful button mashing.

Also, how should I use Shadewalker in pugs? If it transmits 80% of enmity towards the target, does that mean ninjas can pull bosses with suiton + hide?

[Alahra]

Also, how should I use Shadewalker in pugs? If it transmits 80% of enmity towards the target, does that mean ninjas can pull bosses with suiton + hide?

Most bosses (in fact, all that I'm aware of) will detect you even with Hide active, so you can't use Shadewalker this way. It's best used at the start of a boss pull on the tank to help them get an enmity lead (this is especially useful if the tank has weaker gear than you or the other DPS). You can also use it sometimes if the tank hasn't seen a stray monster by putting it on him and then attacking that monster yourself, and it also works to help the tank get enmity back if there is a wipe or something.

[Maero]

Well i do play Nin often enough but am not Nin "main", i had always been told that the earlier you apply ta the better?
I mean it is dependent on fight, group composition, etc...
I am actually asking not indicating people are wrong, lol

[UBERHAXED]

Well i do play Nin often enough but am not Nin "main", i had always been told that the earlier you apply ta the better?
I mean it is dependent on fight, group composition, etc...
I am actually asking not indicating people are wrong, lol

Every class (and I mean every class) has a burst rotation that depends on a 20 second (or set of 20 second) cooldown. Given that they also use potions in the rotation (15 sec) and need to use a few startup skills (e..g heavy thrust+combo to disembowel, 3 hits for GLIII, Fire III/Shapcasted Fire + Blizzard III depending on rotation, dancing edge combo, etc.) they will use the potion in the tail end of the 20 seconds rather than the beginning. Using it at the pull means that you are using it, when no class is ready to take advantage of the bonuses for their burst rotation. So somewhere between 5-10 seconds in the fight will allow everyone with ample to to use their start up skills.

As an easy example, look at ninja. You need to ramp up the first dancing edge combo and don't use B4B or potion until the 2nd or 3rd GCDs. Everyone else is in a similar situation. Even if they use their CDs right as the fight start, if you get TA up before 10 seconds in the fight, it will have 100% up time under their buffs. Because we know this not be the case, we can argue that the best time for TA uptime would be between 5-25 seconds of the fight. Which essentially means you need to use it between 5-15 seconds of the fight starting.

[Maero]

info

Ahh well i usually do not use out of the gate so to say, but thanks for all of that info, also thanks Dante for the info as well
I still main blm but use Ninja for Roulettes or if needed in raids.

[ShiroK]

Hi everyone,
I have been reading some of these last comments and lately I have been wondering if there was a better rotation than what I use. A few days back I have read the Shasta's rotation, which it's reasonable but I think it over complicates a few steps.

I start with Huton and I let my Tank pull when I have 4-5s left for the jutsu cooldown, then it goes:
Internal Release - Spinning edge - Blood for blood - Gust Slash - Pot - Dancing Edge - Suiton - Spinning edge - Trick Attack - Shadow Fang - Kassatsu - Mutilate - Raiton - Spinning Edge - Dream within a dream - Gust slash - Mug + Duality - Aeolian Edge - Jugulate

And then I refresh cds with this priority Huton>Shadow Fang>Dancing Edge>Mutilate.

Duality with AE are done at the last second of TA so it's perfect, IR finishes a few seconds before and duality cannot crit. IR might as well be used after the first Spinning Edge, reducing SE crit rate but it can last longer for some extra crit inside the Trick Attack duration.

[Xenon_S]

As a raiding NIN main, I prefer Suiton on pull, because
1. Eliminates GCD clipping from doing 3-mudra mid rotation
2. Frees up the ninjutsu cooldown sooner, meaning kassatsu can be used sooner

Suiton on DE benefits from b4b ir and maybe foes requiem

Regardless, the opener trick attack is always the same
SF, mutilate, duality aeolian edge, crit raiton, dream within dream, mug
10 seconds for 5 gcd and 4 off gcd actions