Thread: 3.2 PvP: Feast Game Mode Discussion Thread.

Originally Posted by RiceisNice

Popping 8 oGCDs is nowhere near instantaneous, nor would anyone stay at 50% hp for that long, one way or another.

Petite Poutine> [...] letting you launch an attack almost every second when in GL3.

The point I'm making is that MNKs are more than well equipped to utterly destroy in Feast 4v4 light even if it doesn't apply useful resistance debuffs to synergize with the team. Falz tries to make it look like MNKs are worthless now that they can't directly counter SMN/SCH even though MNKs are everywhere in party queues. Melee DPSes are pretty much on par with each other with MNK being just slightly better because of the amount of off global damage cooldowns they have and the slow from Somersault in my opinion.

Originally Posted by FudoMyoo

YOSHIDA:- YOU FORGOT THE MOST IMPORTANT ONE:

ALLOW US TO SAVE THE PVP SKILL SET FOR EACH JOB!!!!!!!!!!

I had to caps cause I'm so pissed off.

Yes this. I'm pretty sure Yoshi said we would be able to have a pvp point allocation loadout per job in a previous letter.

Ok so it took 385 matches, but I finally did run into a Ninja that tried to hide with medals to win. Our dps consisted of DRG and BLM so we had no way of detecting him and he remained hidden for like half the match. While it was certainly funny beating down his smn and ast teammates repeatedly since the match effectively became 4 on 3 its still dumb to have the possibility that we can lose a match via this lame tactic. We were lucky that someone's AoE (idk if it was blm, war or my gierskogul that through some sheer miracle hit him) forced him out of hide with under a minute left in the match and therefore were able to quickly finish him off since he had 9 stacks to win but um yeah SE needs to disable that hide nonsense in Feast if ppl are actually gonna try to cheese it that way.

Originally Posted by Dimitrii

SE needs to disable that hide nonsense in Feast if ppl are actually gonna try to cheese it that way.

Removing Hide would be overkill. They could put Hide on a minute cooldown after unstealthing and make the stealth duration 30 seconds. Or make it so you can't stealth with 3 or more Heavy Metal stacks.

Originally Posted by Petite

Petite Poutine> [...] letting you launch an attack almost every second when in GL3.

The point I'm making is that MNKs are more than well equipped to utterly destroy in Feast 4v4 light even if it doesn't apply useful resistance debuffs to synergize with the team. Falz tries to make it look like MNKs are worthless now that they can't directly counter SMN/SCH even though MNKs are everywhere in party queues. Melee DPSes are pretty much on par with each other with MNK being just slightly better because of the amount of off global damage cooldowns they have and the slow from Somersault in my opinion.

I'm not arguing that monk is weaker per say, but it's a bit misleading when you're pointing out that they have 8 oGCDs (which isn't instantaneous as I mentioned) and it's execution speed is irrelevant to their GCD. Making a pvp-oriented skill useless in pvp is a stupid change for the sake of balance when there can be other areas that can be addressed (such as making SCH not so contingent on aetherflow for healing performance in pvp. I'm not saying they need to be buffed again, but something like somersault shouldn't have been buffed to begin with (which esperated something like OIP affecting aetherflow, which in all honesty, a SMN can counter play, but SCH doesn't have that luxury)

Originally Posted by Dimitrii

This is a good point and I like the second suggestion it sounds like a nice idea to implement since it would still allow them to use trick attack at the start of skirmishes but not hide with an abundance of medals. However is there a specific reason as to why choose to lock it at 3 stacks that im not thinking of or was that number arbitrary? Cause I'd take ur suggestion except go a little further and say if you have heavy medal debuff period you cannot utilize hide.

It should be to the point where you cant stealth with heavy medal. 150 (75 dropped) medal on a single person is still a hefty amount amount. Even if oyu were to keep the NIN out of play, it's not going to make it any easier for the other team to actually kill anyone because they'd still have a healer and tank, stalling would still be feasible.

Even with detection trying to find a stealth NIN is very unlikely due to the size of the arena and the cooldown on detect (as well as the general lack of non-targetted aoes)

I wish they'd change Hide in general... Complete invisibility is just a lame stealth mechanic, more so when it doesn't work on a single damn thing post-50...

Personally, I'd rework the entire mechanic, though that's a lot of work for a single Jobs mechanic... Still;

Swap Hide and Malmsight.
Malmsight is now a PvE skill that displays, and reduces, enemy lines of sight/etc., effectively allowing you to sneak past things with "skill". Sound aggro is handled like it was in 1.0, moving slowly lets you sneak past. Pretty much useless in PvP (like it currently is) like Provoke et al.
Hide is now a PvP skill, and does much the same thing, though only temporarily. Possibly allowed to be used mid-combat as well, since it's a PvP skill now (so we don't need to worry about the PvE balance of that) and while that might seem overpowered, there are hard counters for Hide anyway and the short duration means all that really does is perhaps let a Ninja pop Hide and follow up instantly with Sneak/Trick Attack, freeing up a Ninjutsu.
Attacking while undetected (Malmsight/Hide is up) now grants a status effect similar to Suiton, effectively allowing you to sneak up on an enemy, attack and get that status effect, and still use Sneak Attack (not required if LoS is such that you can get the frontal bonus without being detected).

Then you have a situation where the PvE skill actually lets you feel like a Ninja, running around undetected because you're awesome and can avoid all those cones of vision/etc., slowing down only to sneak past hearing range... I'd find that much more entertaining for PvE, and much more balanced for PvP... Can probably achieve exactly the same thing by just giving Hide a duration in PvP and leaving it at that, though... Which is a shame, because Malmsight is an utter waste of code and Hide is utterly worthless in PvE these days... Heck, it was always worthless because none of this game was made with stealth in mind... Could sneak off and open chests in Darkhold but take a year doing it because of the movement speed, that was about it... Meh... Save a few quests specifically built around Hide, it never had a purpose with how cookie cutter dungeons and raids are in this game...