Novice / Beginner / Training Hall -- General Discussion Topic

[Reinha]

I think WoW's Proving Grounds was very well implemented. It had challenges for every role. The dps one required interrupts and dodging, the tank one required positioning and taunts, and the healer on required dispells and mana (mp) management which is a foreign concept to a lot of healers. There were increasingly difficult levels and defeating the most difficult one with 30 waves of enemies rewarded the player with a title <Proven Healer/Tank/Assailant>. That title alone was enough to make me do it on my main. Do you think it would work as an incentive for this game's community?

In the most recent expansion, defeating the "normal" difficulty (on a scale of easy-normal-hard-extreme) was required to use WoW's Duty Finder to queue for max level dungeons. Not sure how I feel about that, because some people in those dungeons were still pretty bad.

Take a look for yourself, the hardest challenge from a dps perspective: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9DlFUMzcBQw

Oh forgot to mention that all gear was scaled down to a certain item level during the MoP expansion, and the enemies were scaled up to your item level in the WoD expansion (current). I think the MoP model worked a bit better.

[pushin_tin]

What is the novice hall supposed to do about ignorant players already at level cap?

[MeiUshu]

What is the novice hall supposed to do about ignorant players already at level cap?

Novice hall is not for max cap level....so really what is your point ?

I would be more concerne about max cap level ignorant players becoming mentors..THEN your question makes sense and we both know what the answer will be ALAS

[Kallera]

Novice hall is not for max cap level....so really what is your point ?

I would be more concerne about max cap level ignorant players becoming mentors..THEN your question makes sense and we both know what the answer will be ALAS

Well, seeing as how some of the dummies fight back, I don't see a reason why we can introduce common mechanics or tactics that the player needs to see. (I:e: dive bombs, raid wide damage+tankbuster, how some markers mean different things.(thankfully they've cut down on this.)

[MeiUshu]

Well, seeing as how some of the dummies fight back, I don't see a reason why we can introduce common mechanics or tactics that the player needs to see. (I:e: dive bombs, raid wide damage+tankbuster, how some markers mean different things.(thankfully they've cut down on this.)

ohh no doubt, my reaction was related to ignorant players max capped..you really think they will do those ? nope....eh?..they dont need it..they know it already....

[Gilraen]

The only delusion I see in this thread is the one that the raid community is the exemplar of XIV. I play to the best of my ability, but I don't do the raids while they are in raid rotation because of the raid community. I don't want that kind of aggravation in a game. I don't want to be treated like I'm the disease when I'm trying to learn the content, especially if noone tells you anything about it or expects you to watch videos or read guides. Not everyone can learn the feel of the content by watching or reading how someone else did it. Nor do I like to be talked to in a harsh or derogatory manner. Again, this is a game. If I wanted to be treated like I'm at work, I'd go back to work! I don't get where this attitude stems, either. I know I've only ever treated jerks in the ways I've seen these people treating players they've likely never met before.

Now mind, some of the best players I know, raiders who had full sets of dreadwyrm (glamoured over better gear) before it went Duty Finder, are some of the coolest and most level-headed players I've met. These players are very clearly exceptions to the community. The norm I try to avoid, but as patches get older it gets progressively harder to do. The raid community's problem isn't skill level, it's the prevailing attitude driving people away.

[Kaurie]

I have fairly low expectations for the training hall. I am guessing it will do no better job of teaching players how to play than Guildhests.

Players need to know they are bad or not performing well before they learn to improve. They need appropriate feedback to show them as such. As the only difficult content in game is team oriented, it's very easy to blame messups on other players and avoid accepting any blame.

In order for the training hall to succeed, it actually needs to be difficult. However, it won't be, and it will simply be another way to reinforce in peoples minds that they are not as bad as they actually are.

The only delusion I see in this thread is the one that the raid community is the exemplar of XIV. I play to the best of my ability, but I don't do the raids while they are in raid rotation because of the raid community. I don't want that kind of aggravation in a game. I don't want to be treated like I'm the disease when I'm trying to learn the content, especially if noone tells you anything about it or expects you to watch videos or read guides. Not everyone can learn the feel of the content by watching or reading how someone else did it. Nor do I like to be talked to in a harsh or derogatory manner. Again, this is a game. If I wanted to be treated like I'm at work, I'd go back to work! I don't get where this attitude stems, either. I know I've only ever treated jerks in the ways I've seen these people treating players they've likely never met before..

This only happens after the raids have been out for awhile and are no longer in a 'progression' type stage. It's when people who are not top tier try to tackle the raids in progression and refuse to admit that they are actually at fault. They easily toss the blame to whoever they can.

If you raid near the early stages of a raid tier, you won't see any of the toxicity that you're suggesting. I'd say most of the raid community is very nice.

[Elim]

I think this will only effect the PS4 players who want to parse on their own. As long as parsers are "not allowed" outside of the training hall, the basic DPS will always feel like they're entitled to being coddled and not improve.

[RegentP]

10th degree Black belt here i come

[vp_cmc]

Why is there no discussion regarding this?
I see a lot of topics complaining about housing, the relic, etc. But, this should be a much more focal issue.

Is it already in game? I didn't see anything about it in 3.15 patch notes. If not, than nothing to discuss about for now.