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  1. #251
    Player
    Astral145's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2015
    Posts
    375
    Character
    Astral Flame
    World
    Hyperion
    Main Class
    Black Mage Lv 80
    I will leave this here... I hate fate farming period. I hate fates in general. I repeat I absolutely hate fates to the point that I still only have 5 total crystals. Please Devs gives us more options for this part of the phase. Like running all 2.x EX primals synced through DF to gain all the crystals. No rare drops just simply get it done. Those who don't like EX primals can do the fates. I just want to see more options for this. I would rather take a mid core approach to the relic than grinding mindlessly through fates. I want to have some challenge to this. I want to have a fun and thrilling experience. I do not want to turn on Netflix while fate grinding.

    Please devs give us more options for the first phase of the relic... My brain requires stimulation not boring content. Give the players that want more challenge a challenge ... Heck I wouldn't mind having the options to clearing all turns of the coils (synced at lvl 50) as well for another option for the last phase of the 3.2 relic. This would really get more people back into that content.

    OPTIONS OPTIONS and more OPTIONS is the key word here.
    (9)
    Last edited by Astral145; 01-05-2016 at 07:06 PM.

  2. #252
    Player
    Caitlyn's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2014
    Location
    Eden
    Posts
    5,440
    Character
    Geistherz Gungnir
    World
    Shiva
    Main Class
    Sage Lv 100
    Agree. Even skilled players are now forced to farm FATEs like braindead sheep to get 18 ATMAs. Some alternative ways would make it much more attractive to ALL players.

    What about Crystal Tower? Or Coil? There is alot unused 2.X-content since Heavensward, why you still focus on stupid FATEs?

    Daily Quests like:
    Ancient Labyrinth -> 1 of 2 Atmas (Fire and Ice)
    Syrcus Tower -> 1 of 2 Atmas (Water and Earth)
    World of Darkness -> 1 of 2 Atmas (Lightning and Wind)
    (11)
    - Queen of Heal 2022 -
    Quote Originally Posted by Paulecrain View Post
    Damit du als Queen of heal natürlich deine königlichen Wünsche erfüllt bekommst. ♥
    Quote Originally Posted by Dicentis View Post
    Ich finde es eh schon krank, dass du Paules Zitat ungefragt verwendest und ich weiß, dass du nie eine Erlaubnis dafür bekommen hast!

  3. #253
    Player
    neoxdeciple's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Location
    Ipswich
    Posts
    108
    Character
    Shiroe Enchanter
    World
    Moogle
    Main Class
    Dark Knight Lv 60
    Im in complete confusion as to how development with relics come to this conclusion, Ifrit titan and garuda WAS FUN! People ENJOYED IT! they felt amazing SATISFACTION from finally getting their items. Hard modes wasn't an amazingly hard content, in the slightest. it was just right in terms of effort and reward and was a challenge to overcome utilizing brand new exciting content. How many people have you guys even talked to and discovered that they didnt enjoy the way you got those weapons? For gods sake impediment polls for questions you want to ask to get accurate information on the true enjoyment of your players please. I've personally not seen any players who enjoy rehashed grinding EVER.

    You have essentially (in my personal opinion) Taken an amazing idea that tied into the main story amazingly well, that had satisfaction reward and was actually interesting and turned it into .. well... something completely boring

    Just for information i completed two relics without any nerf's only completed second and third coil when echo was implemented, i am in no way a hardcore raider. But relic always gave be something to work toward, and Felt amazing whenyou finally got this brilliant weapon to show off before the rehashing kicked in.

    Id personally urge you to reconsider this. Id loved and played this game since before 2.1. but im just watching the life of things that was amazing start to be drained away

    But thats my 2 cents.
    (16)

  4. #254
    Player
    Velhart's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    Ul'Dah
    Posts
    2,849
    Character
    Velhart Aurion
    World
    Hyperion
    Main Class
    Machinist Lv 80
    Quote Originally Posted by FizzleofHyperion View Post
    snip
    That is just a lazy way for developers to get players in and only works in the short term. The developers are right when they say that FFXIV needs to be it's own thing and any nostalgic factors from other games has to make sense and written well into the story. Things like Crystal Tower and Cloud of Darkness work because they are still part of the FFXIV world and CoD is more of an entity than an actual person.

    All developers need to do to make their three points work is to fix raid structure that I have gone over plenty of times in here, make Diadem have a variety of reasons for wanting to go in without creating an imbalance with raids, and attempt to put fun in between grinds in the relic. In concept, all three are easy to improve, but I am very sure the developers are going to make ways for them to be worse and no one is happy at the end of the day. Raids we know are already going to be worse in design, can check that off. Maybe they can fix Diadem. We know they are going to keep anima weapons absolutely awful, can check that off also.
    (0)

  5. #255
    Player
    Mindy_Macready's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2014
    Posts
    221
    Character
    Mindy Macready
    World
    Lamia
    Main Class
    Summoner Lv 100
    Can we please fix ALC potion crafts back to 2.x while we're at it? You want to help people meet dps checks, make potions easier to craft, with the old 3-per-craft yield back, and mats that aren't gated behind ephemeral nodes, gated further behind RNG.
    (8)

  6. #256
    Player
    Zumi's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    Gridania
    Posts
    4,965
    Character
    Zumi Kasumi
    World
    Sargatanas
    Main Class
    Paladin Lv 100
    Based on the feedback that we have been receiving, we will be lowering the difficulty of Alexander: Midas (Savage) that will be implemented in Patch 3.2, while simultaneously setting the item level of the Savage weapon and the item level of the new Allagan tomestone weapon to be different. We would like to revamp the overall balance moving forward with these changes.
    Is this really going to fix the problem with end game players who have quit because the current savage is still hard?

    Even if the next set of raids is easier, very few will going to see them unless, either the current raids are nerfed or the requirement of beating the current raid to progress to the next raid is dropped. So what is actually going to happen with 3.2? Will there be nerfs and echo to the old savage or will it just not be a requirement to do Midas?
    (0)

  7. #257
    Player
    FeliAiko's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2015
    Posts
    591
    Character
    Feli Aiko
    World
    Odin
    Main Class
    Dragoon Lv 90
    Quote Originally Posted by Zumi View Post
    Is this really going to fix the problem with end game players who have quit because the current savage is still hard?

    Even if the next set of raids is easier, very few will going to see them unless, either the current raids are nerfed or the requirement of beating the current raid to progress to the next raid is dropped. So what is actually going to happen with 3.2? Will there be nerfs and echo to the old savage or will it just not be a requirement to do Midas?
    Most likely you'll only have to clear Midas NM to unlock Savage, since NM is the canon story and Savage is the Minstrel's deliberate re-imagining of what happened.
    (0)

  8. #258
    Player
    Belhi's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2015
    Posts
    3,016
    Character
    J'talhdi Belhi
    World
    Bismarck
    Main Class
    Conjurer Lv 90
    Quote Originally Posted by neoxdeciple View Post
    Im in complete confusion as to how development with relics come to this conclusion, Ifrit titan and garuda WAS FUN! People ENJOYED IT! they felt amazing SATISFACTION from finally getting their items. Hard modes wasn't an amazingly hard content, in the slightest. it was just right in terms of effort and reward and was a challenge to overcome utilizing brand new exciting content. How many people have you guys even talked to and discovered that they didnt enjoy the way you got those weapons? For gods sake impediment polls for questions you want to ask to get accurate information on the true enjoyment of your players please. I've personally not seen any players who enjoy rehashed grinding EVER.

    You have essentially (in my personal opinion) Taken an amazing idea that tied into the main story amazingly well, that had satisfaction reward and was actually interesting and turned it into .. well... something completely boring

    Just for information i completed two relics without any nerf's only completed second and third coil when echo was implemented, i am in no way a hardcore raider. But relic always gave be something to work toward, and Felt amazing whenyou finally got this brilliant weapon to show off before the rehashing kicked in.

    Id personally urge you to reconsider this. Id loved and played this game since before 2.1. but im just watching the life of things that was amazing start to be drained away

    But thats my 2 cents.
    Frankly everything I have heard is ALOT of people complained about the original implementation of the relic because A) it was too difficult for most casual people to get and B) it was easier to get than the raid weapons making raiders less motivated to do Coil.

    They solved this by making the relic very easy but time consuming to get and making it slightly inferior to raid tier weapons. Strickly speaking the relic/anima isn't for players who want a challenge just as Thordian EX and Savage aren't for players who want an easy experience.

    Quote Originally Posted by Mindy_Macready View Post
    Can we please fix ALC potion crafts back to 2.x while we're at it? You want to help people meet dps checks, make potions easier to craft, with the old 3-per-craft yield back, and mats that aren't gated behind ephemeral nodes, gated further behind RNG.
    I honestly haven't found this a problem since there are ephemeral nodes up somewhere almost all the time and the dust you need from them for potions is pretty common.
    (0)
    Last edited by Belhi; 01-06-2016 at 11:25 AM.

  9. #259
    Player
    Velhart's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    Ul'Dah
    Posts
    2,849
    Character
    Velhart Aurion
    World
    Hyperion
    Main Class
    Machinist Lv 80
    Quote Originally Posted by Belhi View Post
    snip
    Here is where the sad thing lies in relic weapons. If the developers intend to make it for people who want to go the easy yet long route to getting the weapon, then whatever. However, their team who are suppose to be making fun content believes that only mindless grinds should be in it. I remember they used interesting content back then like puzzles that couldn't simply be looked up on a guide since people's quest were different from one another. It was very interesting and fun, and also did not require much out of the player besides working your brain. Why can't there be steps like this between the grind? Why can't developers put something fun in between the grinds. Use methods that goes strongly into the lore, keeping things interesting. You don't have to use battle content, it doesn't have to be 100% mindless grind the way through. Just give people some time to breath and not hitting the same mob for days/weeks.

    As much as I disagree with SE's approach to relics, they have to at least attempt to be creative in doing these quests. Not simply slap old content together and tell people to bang their heads on the keyboard till they receive a prize. All they care about right now is taking the easy route out, not actually caring about being creative.
    (1)

  10. #260
    Player
    Belhi's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2015
    Posts
    3,016
    Character
    J'talhdi Belhi
    World
    Bismarck
    Main Class
    Conjurer Lv 90
    Quote Originally Posted by Velhart View Post
    Here is where the sad thing lies in relic weapons. If the developers intend to make it for people who want to go the easy yet long route to getting the weapon, then whatever. However, their team who are suppose to be making fun content believes that only mindless grinds should be in it. I remember they used interesting content back then like puzzles that couldn't simply be looked up on a guide since people's quest were different from one another. It was very interesting and fun, and also did not require much out of the player besides working your brain. Why can't there be steps like this between the grind? Why can't developers put something fun in between the grinds. Use methods that goes strongly into the lore, keeping things interesting. You don't have to use battle content, it doesn't have to be 100% mindless grind the way through. Just give people some time to breath and not hitting the same mob for days/weeks.

    As much as I disagree with SE's approach to relics, they have to at least attempt to be creative in doing these quests. Not simply slap old content together and tell people to bang their heads on the keyboard till they receive a prize. All they care about right now is taking the easy route out, not actually caring about being creative.
    They never put puzzles into the Zodiak questline though, and though they did that once in 2.x, when they did anything similar in 3.0 with the Broom quests people complained.

    I'd also add that 'fun' is often relative. I tend to find PvP style games lose my interest very quickly as competitive gameplay holds lasting interest for me. However PvP is clearly a very fun pastime for a lot of people.

    One of SE's challenges is to create content that will be playable and consumed by the largest portion of their playerbase possible. Things that will only appeal to a smaller portion then to get relegated to the occasional extras. This is one of the reasons you see a lot more casual gameplay than challenging. Simply put there are a lot more people playing casual gameplay than is playing challenging. I wouldn't be surprised to find the number of players who have actually downed Thordian EX to be well under 10%.

    SE tries to mitigate this somewhat by adding story or trying to add a little diversity or even just giving interesting rewards. However this is bound to be a constant issue SE has as they try to balance what content they deliver. From their perspective the people who really would get value out of the relic are people who wouldn't be getting it other ways like doing the EX primals. Regardless, due to the power of the end relic they were always going to gate it behind a lot of time consuming effort regardless. Running Ravana EX 30 times wasn't going to get a player a weapon on par with the weapon drop from savage Alex.
    (0)
    Last edited by Belhi; 01-06-2016 at 01:23 PM.

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