AST's weakness in end game

[Risvertasashi]

I got idea since all those claiming AST is fine go run double as in savage 1 in noct sect the other in diurnal sect ... Now since we are mimics of whm/ sch we should be able to do it no problem at all

Well, this is wrong because noct stance does not mimic SCH. It mimics a WHM with shields rather than HoTs. SCH is much, much more than just shields.

All that said AST can replace WHM pretty handily. And yes, WHM + noct AST in A3S works (though I prefer SCH). Not sure on A4S but I bet someone's done it.

[TatoRazzino]

I got idea since all those claiming AST is fine go run double as in savage 1 in noct sect the other in diurnal sect ... Now since we are mimics of whm/ sch we should be able to do it no problem at all ... I want video prove of it linked on thos forum....until then ast needs a major rework with its identity and not shadow whm/sch and copy there regens/shield.. Or fairy/divine seal (cough synasty) .... Yes we can do content because we are being carried by the SCH or the WHM.... Ast on it self cannot do it.. Try it with double ast and u will see the problems we have ... So until then just suck it up at wait for changes towards ast

If you're being carried, that's your problem, not the job's. If you feel like you're being carried when playing AST, you'd be carried by your healing partner if you were playing any other job. Using double WHM in savage offers no mitigation, which will be a problem in A3S for example, and running double SCH is more stressful than running double AST, because AoE healing becomes a problem when Emergency Tactics/Indomitability is burned (and I'm not even mentioning the fact that the Aetherflow stack system will reduce healing output by a lot if the SCH has no WHM or AST to back them up). No one runs double AST not because it isn't possible, but because it's stupid to take double jobs to ANY content in the game; using double jobs only stacks weaknesses, since all the strengths are covered when one person playing the job is there.

[HopeEstheim]

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This is exactly the problem: your co-healer doesn't want to DPS. WHM/AST combo allows more AoE healing output and stronger single target burst for both healers, which means that both of you can stance dance in different situations and add your share of DPS. You can't use the same healing strategy you use for WHM/SCH because Nocturnal is not supposed to be a SCH replacement. Scratch the 2.X meta and use new strategies, instead of trying to make a job do something it was not designed to do.

Again this was not a complaint, just a fact, I don't have any problem in term of healing with my co healer. Of course a N. Sect AST will never replace a SCH, and I like the fact that I can adapt myself to all the situation with the stances. But anyway I was just saying that I prefer using Diurnal instead of Nocturnal with my co healer, nothing else. Moreover I don't care if I have to handle all the dps part myself, I love my AST too much, I will never change back to SCH, as long as it doesn't slow down my static.

[TatoRazzino]

Again this was not a complaint, just a fact, I don't have any problem in term of healing with my co healer. Of course a N. Sect AST will never replace a SCH, and I like the fact that I can adapt myself to all the situation with the stances. But anyway I was just saying that I prefer using Diurnal instead of Nocturnal with my co healer, nothing else.

I apologize if I sounded aggressive. My criticism was not directed at you specifically, but at your co-healer and at the community. You said you felt as if you were being carried, but you're also carrying a WHM if they refuse to DPS, since both AST and WHM have similar DPS spells/skills.

[Troile]

I do agree that Noct could use some work. However, consider that AST can soloheal Thordan EX. The "AST is fine" bandwagon is pretty justified IMO: Overall, it is fine.

I never said that any of the "bandwagons" were incorrect. I was merely making a comment on the act of "jumping on the bandwagon" without actually considering the truthfulness/accuracy of a topic. Meaning some people tend to just follow the crowd because many people are saying the same thing.

At any rate, we agree so I guess it doesn't matter. It irritates me so much that I can do my healing job without ever needing or wanting to dust off Nocturnal Sect. It makes me think that the job was short changed. I'd much rather it was replaced with something I would feel compelled to use.....

[HopeEstheim]

I apologize if I sounded aggressive. My criticism was not directed at you specifically, but at your co-healer and at the community. You said you felt as if you were being carried, but you're also carrying a WHM if they refuse to DPS, since both AST and WHM have similar DPS spells/skills.

Haha sorry then ^_^'
But I don't feel carried at all, in fact, my co healer is a bit new to healing since she was a ninja before, so I'm doing some extra work to help her, but as long as we are clearing content while I can enjoy playing AST, I don't care xD

[AzureFlare]

I got idea since all those claiming AST is fine go run double as in savage 1 in noct sect the other in diurnal sect ... Now since we are mimics of whm/ sch we should be able to do it no problem at all ... I want video prove of it linked on thos forum....until then ast needs a major rework with its identity and not shadow whm/sch and copy there regens/shield.. Or fairy/divine seal (cough synasty) .... Yes we can do content because we are being carried by the SCH or the WHM.... Ast on it self cannot do it.. Try it with double ast and u will see the problems we have ... So until then just suck it up at wait for changes towards ast

Fine, know what? Just started rebooting our casual scrub static. Got a new AST healer who loves it and likes Nocturnal, I myself do not intend to switch to WHM/SCH.
Challenge accepted. Probably also challenge failed, but at least we'll have some good fun instead of going with a tryhard composition and questioning whether or not we're enjoying the game. And meh, AST can pretty much soloheal A1S, A2S is doable too, why not A3S or A4S. We 'overgear the content' anyway, if it is up to the massive crowd of nay-sayers still stuck on A3S with said overgeared sets.

I'll definitely disagree that an AST 'gets carried by the SCH or WHM' though, that's just plain wrong. For the sole reason an AST can replace a WHM in savage just fine, unless you're claiming a WHM too is being carried by SCH.

[Vlady]

As someone posted in another thread - AST can clear content. Gameplay-wise, it's pretty solid.

Identity-wise, it needs a lot of work. With no clear identity on its own (diurnal/WHM and nocturnal/SCH) it not only has to compete with itself (which stance is better. There will always be one that's better) but it will also compete with the other healers. It needs its own niche of healing.

Yes, it's got a card drawing system - it needs to be emphasized more.

That is just in the eye of the beholder. When I see astro I see cards and support buffs that can heal. Seems like it doesnt have a identity problem but just some people want to be as strong as white mages (which they now are if not stronger) and be able to dps/shield as well as a scholar while supplying said buffs. It does not have to emphasize its identity any more because that is what almost everyone sees when they think of Astrologian.

I am oddly suprised that people are defending astro as fine now and days. Even months after the buffs to astros people screamed bloody murder for more buffs and enhancements to card buffs but before the astro should be given a single new buff they will have to receive a nerf to the healing potency.

[Yhisa]

Bleh... Ast need more focus around the cards ... I would happily have shuffled changed to a 5sec or 10sec cooldown so i can fight it out with my RNG to get the card i want but some cards need changing

We all know balance is way to good, bole is always throw on tank, and arrow is just bleh yay for speed

Spear is too situational and i throw on ninja/mech/smn/brd/urself due to gcd and if i need it to lower my own skill cooldowns

Spire and ewer is just ughhh let the mech and bard do there jobs and use songs/turret to regen mp/tp

Majority of the time asts will always spread balance arrow or bole, some ast spread ewer for self due to not using illuminate aether right, the rest is just a pain in the ass and is often wasted by shuffle or if ur clever u just click it off

[Yhisa]

Im a good ast and super aggressive and always blasting away in cleric stance, using essential and keep my benefic 2 procs for cleric stance, if tank taking a real beating i will use synasty, aspect benefic, aspec helios, collective unconcious , into time malipination , and bam 3k-4k hots for 30secs which allows me to stay in cleric for longer and dps

But what lets me down is i dont feel like an astrologian.. Apart from the cards, Im just a generic healer with hots shields and heals, This is my problem with ast.. I dont fit into my own lore, i mean when i read astrologian this comes to mind

Foresight, tarot readings, star readings, present, future, past, etc but i do not feel like this at all.. The card mechanic is nice but other then that.. Ast is just another generic healer , and to be honest having RNG for a healer is extreamly bad.. In future how would u use ast to push content when his/her buffs are random as hell, In the past wasnt corsair looked upon due to RNG aswell