Thoughs on removing cross class skills and adding 5 new skills for each job come 4.0?

**Eidolon** · 12-01-2015 07:19 AM

Originally Posted by Kaiser-Ace

Won't matter after I PK you in the Arena.

PVP and DPS are not the same thing... XD I won't even pretend to be good at PVP, "Mister God-Slayer" (PFFFFFFFFFFFT) and the fact that your reaction to directly comparing numbers (I'd lower my gear level to yours if need be) is "OMG FYTE ME 1 ON 1" without any actual rebuttle... just shows how much of an emberassment to Dragoons you are. XD

I don't know any Dragoons that say DET doesn't matter... But I guess that's a perspective of people you meet.

**LandricFrey** · 12-01-2015 07:22 AM

I can see the cross-class system getting reworked for 4.0. They'd have to make some major changes, but they need to anyway to address the current "skill-bloat." They may add, takeaway, and/or combine skills as long as they keep jobs mostly balanced. Many people are afraid of change; I, however, look forward to the possibility of fresh feeling jobs in the next expansion.

And please, SE, get rid of classes.(and separate SMN and SCH once and for all.) Classes don't belong in an FF game, and they only confuse new players.

**CrystalRainbow** · 12-01-2015 07:59 AM

Unless they rethink this. I will run out of space on my bars.

Also no provoke tank swap not happening. don't need 3 things that all do the same things.

**Kaiser-Ace** · 12-01-2015 08:12 AM

Originally Posted by Eidolon

PVP and DPS are not the same thing... XD I won't even pretend to be good at PVP, "Mister God-Slayer" (PFFFFFFFFFFFT) and the fact that your reaction to directly comparing numbers (I'd lower my gear level to yours if need be) is "OMG FYTE ME 1 ON 1" without any actual rebuttle... just shows how much of an emberassment to Dragoons you are. XD

I don't know any Dragoons that say DET doesn't matter... But I guess that's a perspective of people you meet.

I thought you were challenging me in that last paragraph? If not then I apologize for misreading that. But being as console player don't have tracking programs, and PC Parser are illegal programs by extension, how would this comparison work? I smack the target dummy and take your word for it? That's hardly an objective way to determine it. And I'll be the first to admit I'm garbage in PvP as well. Most people seem to be, especially in frontlines. Seem like the good Sir Eidolon though is a petulant teenager the way he responds to opposition.

Let me expose the truth on Parser futility. The "Dps Checks" have a minimum number required as do all content stat checks, but they are actually quite low. The Minimum Item Level is the only point where rotation and numbers matter more than dodging and paying attention. Anything else exceeding the gear requirement is more than enough. My item level being 200 with my Det and Crit both barley under 600, my accuracy well over 600, and nearly 1100 STR far exceeds nearly all stat checks with the exception of Thorden EX who's minimum DPS requirement is a little higher than usual. Savage Alexander, all of the Coils, and even the 8 EX primals are more about paying attention and staying in synch as a team. And the big kicker, is that individual DPS is not what is measured but GROUP DPS. So as long as the team as a whole is meeting the check all you have to do is, to quote so many tanks, "Dodge and Don't Die."

So to recap, having maybe a few digits less than a single lulgoon is irrelevant when we're all dead. And if no one dies when the group as a whole meets the checks, instant win. Your DPS data is irrelevant. Unless the Instant wipe Hard Enrage activates you meet the minimum requirements. Then all you need to do is stay alive. If you passed the check but died anyway then no amount of gear or DPS increase will fix that. A Dead Player's DPS is Zero after all.

But I digress, perhaps it would be far better to have a TRUE specialized job by abolishing the cross skill system. Truth be told, I could do with out the melee cross skills. And mages could simply have a roll over skill tacked on like how Stoneskin 2 was added. Then maybe these "Meta" arguments would end and we could all be like WoW where we have that One Skill we're good for and just sit back in the zerg till it's time to fire. Oh how interesting that would be, like looking through Chocobo Crap for Gysahl Greens.

Long story short, If I wanted to see a train wreak of an MMO with zero customization and all the stat and skill choices made for me, I'd play maplestory instead. The Cross skills are to make up for gaps in the unite not stand us out as lone wolves. I take a fire ball to the face and I'm dead on arrival, A Paladin how ever can eat it and keep going. he goes down though and I can survive long enough for the healer to rez him and the tank to regain control. This is ultimately a Unit vs Lone Wolf argument and thus a farce since this is a Massively Multiplayer Online Role Playing Game aka a Team effort. So when lone wolves stop dieing in raids for the sake of their DPS then I'll allow critiques on my skill choices.

**Felis** · 12-01-2015 08:43 AM

Originally Posted by Eidolon

Could probably have the skill learned via a 62 quest, but make the level of the skill itself level 20.

sorta like how when you do AST, you do one quest to unlock the job at 30, but they still have pre-30 skills for levelsynch balancing.

A WHM at lv 59 would still not have that skill.
For ASt with lv1-30 skills it work because the AST start with lv 30.

**Eidolon** · 12-01-2015 08:52 AM

Originally Posted by Kaiser-Ace

Snip

lol... 'petulant teenager'... You are really bad at appologising for misunderstandings if you through out an insult in t he same base. I'll just accept your appology and move on - that's easy enough to do, "Sir God Slayer" (PFFFFFFFFFFFF)

Nah, I meant like, a training dummy so we can kinda clean up the rotation a bit. I tend to work with a lot of dragoons on their rotation. And I'm rarely outdone in content on damage because I can handle a good rotation and mechanics at the same time. Thordan EX is just a recent example - I've always been a pretty exemplary player of Mechanics > DPS and that MNK's need to get off their lazy ***'s and do some with the rest of the group (Nothing funnier than a MNK who doesnt' do mechanics doing less DPS than a DRG though.)

Here's my issue with you, however:

Not a single bit of this supports the idea that "Mercy Stroke is useless!" This is what everyone was calling you out on - that oyu literally, in the same breath, try to call a staple skill of anyone who actually pushes their numbers 'useless' while simultaneously toting how your "Fracture" is better than it. You offer up nothing to support contrary to this - and instead, you're now going into a tangent about lack of customization and how min/maxers don't matter and that all that matters is group dps and mechanics.

So I'm not sure where your tangent came from. It just seems to be a sidebar out of desperation and a failure to reaise just why people are pointing out your choice in cross classes are atrocious (Though I do agree with you, to an extent - as I stated myself. Featherfoot is lul-worthy.)

Heck, even the fact that you call another dragoon "Lulgoon" in your own post... I dunno man. There's just something about your complete lack of an arguement that doesn't sit well with me.

You change gears more than the Fast and the Furious series.

Originally Posted by Felis

A WHM at lv 59 would still not have that skill.
For ASt with lv1-30 skills it work because the AST start with lv 30.

hmn... you're definitely right.

Well, it's not like they have to have the skill learned via quest. I think that they can unlock it via the job just like a leveling skill - so once you hit 20, it's yours? That'd be a pretty good alternative, and would help with the issue of low-level players not having enough buttons to press (Looking at you, sastasha!)

**Derio** · 12-01-2015 08:52 AM

WTF is the OP thinking. This is a terrible idea..... Just pure no. Where is the face palm gifs. No to the original post.

**Venjamin** · 12-01-2015 09:16 AM

Originally Posted by Eidolon

Snip

Dude, I am so in love with you. I'm still working on Dragoon, but I swear on Thor's frosty nipples that this is the most well-organized explanation of cross-class DPS maximization for them that I've ever seen. The fact that you're schooling someone with provable numbers is just icing on the cake.

@Kaiser - "Team DPS" is definitely a thing. But to NOT maximize your points puts an inherent strain on the rest of the team.

Your job is to DPS to the best of your ability. If your DPS wanes, the likelihood of failure increases. If everyone has your same attitude, pushing only what they deem to be 'reasonable' numbers, that likelihood CONTINUES to increase. That's the only reason people use Parsers, so they can maximize their output and can make sure everything moves smoothly.

If your whole team fails, but your bonus DPS from maximizing could have put you over the threshold, what's your excuse?

**ErikMynhier** · 12-01-2015 10:50 AM

Originally Posted by Nav_Fae

I'd much rather them add the PvP skills into 4.0 as PvE skills instead of recreating the same skill to replace cross class skills in 4.0

Oh gods give me Purify on my PLD.

Thread: Thoughs on removing cross class skills and adding 5 new skills for each job come 4.0?

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