Enmity build up on untargetable bosses

[Eisenhower]

I'm bundling some quotes here since they are both relevant to the reply below.

As far as the speculation in your latter part of the post goes - that is some really heavy speculation, but I am not saying it is impossible. [...] with the issue with AST rising up again.
[...] Let's say Scholars are the ones next who will have enmity issues [...]

That's one of my main arguments as to why I believe changes are better directed at the AST.

If a healer (actually, pick any job, it still applies) as an entity has runaway problems or scaling issues regarding enmity, mana, healing output, DPS, etc. then the solution should not be making changes to the various pieces of content it is pitted against - it is the job itself that is broken. And it means that every time something new is introduced, this internally unsound job can run into problems that requires another fix. It is better in the long run to have a well-designed job that scales well and handles new things well than making changes to wider systems in order to accommodate inconveniences such as this. The better a job is designed, the fewer changes will be needed in the future.

If Squeenix introduce new jobs with the same issue as old jobs had before they were addressed, then Squeenix need to take a hard look at their design team, 'cause someone is in that case making the same mistakes over and over again.

And to highlight a final thing: changes made to a job does not automatically equate to that job being homogenized in relation to other jobs. Two jobs can achieve similar end results with vastly different tools. If the one can only see homogenization as a solution to making all jobs viable, it's time to take a step back and look outside of the box.

I do hope you realise you're not even in line with yourself here. Not addressing this would involve [...]

Foregoing the displacement enmity change does also not exclude playing your job and pushing for extra DPS both among tanks and healers just as before and provoking back the boss when it returns. I don't understand the notion of healers becoming the main target for a moment without dying being the worst thing in the world (doubly so if it is consistent and you can plan for/around it). We die on purpose to circumvent mechanics, we run into danger to build LB or improve DPS uptime, all these peculiar sacrifices and inconveniences - but this one is for some reason unbearable.

[Mutemutt]

To be honest, I think this is largely an issue with astrologian's enmity tool rather than the fights themselves. It's just not nearly as effective at reducing hate in the long run compared to whm's shroud. Though I do think the current situation is acceptable overall, since tanks can gain plenty of enmity with ease and healers should be worried about how much hate they're generating which is, of course, directly related to how much overhealing they're doing (well, the mt I usually run with for Thordan ex is so busy trying to outrun the ot for hate, that he already has a sizable lead over me).

Even when you bring in the "now my mt has to get more hate and loses dps", you have to weigh that against the gain in party wide dps from bringing astrologian (well, at least my group usually sees an increase and I dps about as much as ast as I do as whm). If someone has some math as to how many enmity combos it would take for the loss of mt dps to outweigh the average increase in party dps from ast buffs in a 10-15 min fight or so, I'd like to see it. It wouldn't swing me one way or the other, but it would be interesting to see just how extra enmity you can afford to get without going negative on dps (assuming you need the extra enmity in the first place).

Anyway, I feel that even if you did change how enmity works for untargetable bosses, it's very possible that astrologian will run into aggro issues in fights with targetable bosses but high aoe damage; iirc there was already a thread that talked about that when it came to A3s. I think it's best to address astrologian's enmity management directly, honestly.

[AzureFlare]

To be honest, I think this is largely an issue with astrologian's enmity tool rather than the fights themselves. It's just not nearly as effective at reducing hate in the long run compared to whm's shroud. Though I do think the current situation is acceptable overall, since tanks can gain plenty of enmity with ease and healers should be worried about how much hate they're generating which is, of course, directly related to how much overhealing they're doing (well, the mt I usually run with for Thordan ex is so busy trying to outrun the ot for hate, that he already has a sizable lead over me).

Pretty much. If it snapshots the same as all other buffs snapshot, you're already shooting yourself for not thinking ahead if you toss out AoE HoT heals before you use LA, and I know I forget that myself nearly all the time. Can imagine more people forget it as well. Besides, healing is usually way more roller coaster than just a 20s segment with super-heavy healing every 2 minutes and that's assuming LA lines up with it anyway. If they don't change the way it works they could at least increase the reduction rate to compensate for the way harder use. Otherwise just make it a self-target Smoke Screen or a reverse enmity generator (healing reduces your enmity for the duration). Complexity for the sake of complexity should be killed, not encouraged. It's only fine now since technically a tank can do more DPS combos than less (lock highest threat ability -> DPS buff -> Provoke -> Bop it and be in the lead by miles) but once T9 comes back, oh boy.

[KarstenS]

We have to take into consideration: T9 was not designed with AST in mind. I'm aware of the issue in this fight.

Back to Thordan:

Have done it as Whitemage (Video link) and as Astrologian (Video link), played it in a similar compareable way and didn't ran into issues by emnity.