Workshops - getting 4 people in there to progress a tier is getting tedious

[NotOliverB]

You're welcome!

Thanks for failing again to adress my point about making an actual argument against the requested QoL-feature to remove the arbitrary light-party requirement in workshops, which is what this topic is about. I'll file that under "you dont have a good argument for keeping it", so how about you join our efforts to have it removed when its there for no reason whatsoever? Or provide actual reason to keep it in place if you care about having 3 people afk in your worksgop so much - I'd like to hear why you find that enjoyable enough to defend it

I've already stated that it's an FC only facility. That's why you don't have it in personal houses. That's why it should stay the way it is

[Ryaz]

It can definitely be a pain.

What I find more tedious is the rng on top of rng on top of rng. You have a chance of no quality upgrade even with HQ mats, then if you do get an upgrade it's a random amount and then it's another rng chance for better progress. Literally had NQ turn ins give higher percent chance than all HQ.

It's like SE hates the players.

[MicahZerrshia]

It's like SE hates the players.

Are you kidding? It's one of the few things they do that is loving and kind lol.

This allows us to just quick craft everything and when you need hundreds or thousands of items it can shave hours off the process. Honestly quality upgrades don't matter really because if you have to hq 90 items vs quick synthing them, vs the time saved you are much better off just turning in nq anyway. If it made any difference in the end parts, sure, but it doesn't. And since non of the items you need are difficult to get, even saving 1/3 of the turn ins is no big deal.

Progress upgrades are basically just one of those systems that makes noise and flashes to make you feel like you were rewarded when really you weren't. A system highly utilized, esp in games to create some excitement in an otherwise unrewarding and monotonous system.

[Chiami]

Giving this another bump, because really, the light party requirement just punishes smaller FCs, and is probably one of the main reasons why this feature is so utterly underused (as was said by devs themselves). Giving us submarines won't make it get used more, removing the light party requirement will.

I am currently poking my (not small) friends list to find 4 people who a) are currently subbed and b) have the TIME to stand for a while in my workshop doing 100% nothing instead of enjoying their valuable gaming time (they pay for with their subs), and it is a painful exercise for everyone involved.

By now we have gone to the point where people stay logged in when they go to sleep and afk all night in my workshop while I churn out wheels for everyone in preparation for 5.0. Is that what was meant with "cooperation"? I don't think so, but it's the reality on how this feature ends up being...

So please, remove the requirement. Still allow all FC members to contribute mats, but progressing a project is not tied to a party being present. This would be such a booster to the FC workshop and its usage.

I think a good idea presented by someone else in the past could also be considered: You can progress alone, but if there is a party present the chance to require less mats for the next step is reduced. Bonus for people who work together, but not making the workshop an exercise of afking.

Pretty Pleaaaaaase (with cherry on top)

[TitaniaZero]

Another year and another, please give up the light party thing! My poor FC has only me every other month! How am I supposed upgrade these things! (Wonder if I should hope that Shadowbringers breaks the Light Party limit.)

[Final-Fantasy]

Actually, removing the minimum requirement of four party members for workshop content would only have a positive affect, because as it is now, it is very difficult to find help because everyone knows someone is making huge amounts of Gil as a result of this restriction, including myself.
With house glamours being very much a popular item, the problem is the wall itself is costing the average player MORE than the plot and house price... I actually try to supply walls at cheap prices, though when it comes to the MB, i have no choice but to list at an insanely high price to prevent reselling of my items. That is just one example of why this needs priority attention, but the other as noted prior to my post, the other three party members GET NO REWARD and just stand around for a few minutes to an hour or more in some cases, doing NOTHING, yes we know other " FC " members could help, but they need to meet addition requirements and to be honest they are so much trouble, we can't even get members to help.
Thus, here we are YEARS later, no better off.


Please review and remove the requirement for the benefit of everyone.

[Chiami]

Giving this thread another bump. It has been almost 4 years, and we are still straddled with the 4-man restriction punishing smaller FCs and making people afk in their valuable play time.

Pleaaaase SE... remove this restriction. You will see a considerable uptick in workshop use in return, I am sure.

[Jojoya]

Giving this thread another bump. It has been almost 4 years, and we are still straddled with the 4-man restriction punishing smaller FCs and making people afk in their valuable play time.

Pleaaaase SE... remove this restriction. You will see a considerable uptick in workshop use in return, I am sure.

You're assuming that SE is unhappy with the amount of workshop use, or that they want to turn the workshop into solo player content. I doubt either is the case.

If we're going to convince SE to make changes to how progressing a project works, saying it's hard to get 4 players together in the workshop is the wrong argument to use. The truth is it's not hard to get 4 players in a workshop even as a small FC. My alt was the only active member of her FC for several months yet I never had a problem getting others to come hang out in the workshop when I was working on expanding and upgrading the FC airship and sub fleet. At no point did I feel I was being punished.

What we need to point out is that it's a bad system to require 3 players to be present solely to watch one other player to select a menu option. FC members can contribute to an active project on the fabrication station without being in a group, assuming they have the proper level class and FC rank permissions. The only thing that requires a party is progressing or completing the project, and only the party leader does something to accomplish those things. The other party members do nothing at all. Their presence serves no meaningful purpose.

That's bad game design and that's why a change is needed.

[Nixxe]

The restriction, or at least some restriction like it, is necessary to discourage people from using it as a personal workshop. It's fine as it is. If you can't get four people together to sit in the workshop, you're an FC in name only anyway. If anything, I think they should increase the stringency of the requirement such that the four people all have to belong to the FC.

[Chiami]

You're assuming that SE is unhappy with the amount of workshop use, or that they want to turn the workshop into solo player content. I doubt either is the case.

If we're going to convince SE to make changes to how progressing a project works, saying it's hard to get 4 players together in the workshop is the wrong argument to use. The truth is it's not hard to get 4 players in a workshop even as a small FC. My alt was the only active member of her FC for several months yet I never had a problem getting others to come hang out in the workshop when I was working on expanding and upgrading the FC airship and sub fleet. At no point did I feel I was being punished.

What we need to point out is that it's a bad system to require 3 players to be present solely to watch one other player to select a menu option. FC members can contribute to an active project on the fabrication station without being in a group, assuming they have the proper level class and FC rank permissions. The only thing that requires a party is progressing or completing the project, and only the party leader does something to accomplish those things. The other party members do nothing at all. Their presence serves no meaningful purpose.

That's bad game design and that's why a change is needed.

We have the word from the devs themselves, in some interviews over the last few years, that they consider the workshop an underused feature, and tried to revitalize it with things like submarines. Yoshida also said already several years ago they want to listen to feedback from the playerbase about what to do with workshops -- sadly so far nothing has come from it, besides submarines which are essentially just more airships in a new garment.

So I am not assuming anything here, as we have interviews stating about as much.

While for making it solo player content, I never said to make it that. We do not know whether the devs want to keep it strictly group content or are okay with one-man-FCs also utilizing the workshop alone, and I think that is irrelevant for this case and request stated by now numerous times over -years-. Personally I have no problem with the workshop requiring some group interaction -- or allowing it also to be done solo, the amount of work involved to make ships and the like is pretty hefty for one person and as such already working as a bit of a gate, while quickly churning out a few aetherial wheels for the FC is just a convenience if we could do it solo.

What is not irrelevant is that maybe some small FCs like yours have no problem to get outside people spending their valuable time afking in someone else's workshop, so I'm glad it was not a bad experience for you. I have been in the same position -- the only one subbed in FCs -- and it was always a huge hassle to ask people to please stand in the workshop, besides the pretty bad feeling of encroaching on their time like that, knowing full well many of them have maybe at best an hour or at best three every day (if even every day at all) for XIV and I was taking away from that with the request.

So while it might have been fine for you... others in small FCs, or in FCs where a lot of their members are currently unsubbed have a harder time using the workshop due to the party requirement, which does make it punishing for some small FCs, and it is punishing for all the non-FC members who out of kindness sacrifice their time for this when they help out.

It is also inherently bad design to require people to stand around doing nothing -- "if it is not fun you are doing it wrong". There is no fun in afking in a workshop, it is wasting valuable gaming time. So regardless whether it is intended to be group content or not, you are right that the presence of 3 people in the workshop as it is right now serves no purpose and needs to be changed.

The easiest way would be to just remove the party requirement, while any FC member with sufficient DoH level can contribute mats any time, and any FC member regardless of DoH levels can progress the project any time -- allowing it to remain a group project. Yes that means solo or three-man FCs could also use the workshop, whatever, it's not like this would break the game. If anything that is the state as it is right now -anyway-, given people with solo-FCs then drag other, non-FC-people into their workshop and just use it anyway (on the backs of those who are helping out like this).

Alternatively and if it is felt as such a huge problem if solo-FCs might use the workshop here an idea: Any given project could require at least 2 FC members to contribute to the project at some point in some way. Personally though I think that would be somewhat pointless -- people could just park an alt in their solo FC and thus circumvent the entire requirement again, as they do right now with the party requirement by having non-FC members afk at their workshop.

It is just a pointless hassle and waste of time spent in unfun ways, the light party requirement, and needs to go.