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  1. #91
    Player
    Nekotee's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2014
    Location
    Uldah
    Posts
    1,574
    Character
    Akihiko Hoshie
    World
    Moogle
    Main Class
    Astrologian Lv 100
    It is hard to gather in diadem...
    Lots of horrible monster that can see past your invisibily...

    Gathering in diadem is a challenge !
    A battlefield, where you need to be better than a ninja... To collect your node.

    Gatherer can be in diadem as much as DoM and DoW
    They just need not to be able to loot (just like Alexander savage invisible loot if you down it a second time)
    But in the same time... It would be nice for DoM and DoW to have a reduced cap of participation if a DoL is in the party

    ...

    Does some star rank can be trigger with gathering ? Like some old S rank in ARR
    That would put gatherer in a better place...
    And we would see less discriminating PF against gatherer

    There should be penalty for teams that do not finish their diadem's goal
    Forcing them to kill a bit more low level monster or forcing themto gather or fly around for crystal/hided chest
    (0)

  2. #92
    Player
    LunnaRavenheart's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Posts
    146
    Character
    Lunna Ravenheart
    World
    Ragnarok
    Main Class
    Arcanist Lv 70
    When I join to Diadem I see objectives, like collect 8 bronze chest, mine 12 nodes, botany 16 nodes, collect some red crystal, collect some white crystal.

    So fighters are gonna collect chest, gatherers are going for nodes, somebody will collect crystal and thats it.
    I dont see anywhere written that i am supposed to farm mobs at dino island for 80 more minutes after objectives are completed.

    Can you please explain to me why some people are expecting this?
    (4)

  3. #93
    Player
    Zojha's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2015
    Posts
    3,565
    Character
    Lodestone Bait
    World
    Pandaemonium
    Main Class
    Gladiator Lv 1
    Quote Originally Posted by LunnaRavenheart View Post
    Can you please explain to me why some people are expecting this?
    I reckon for the same reason they expect you to come and start fighting right away in your daily expert roulette, rather than first sitting at the start, walking and emoting around, typing elaborate paragraphs about your character's reactions and thoughts to his/her sorroundings before starting to "walk" further (not run).

    It doesn't say anywhere that you shouldn't do that. It's just kind of expected that you don't. On that note: Not joining FCs with the sole intention of plundering the FC bank at some point is also something that's simply socially expected for some odd reasons. People are weird like that.
    (0)

  4. #94
    Player
    LunnaRavenheart's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Posts
    146
    Character
    Lunna Ravenheart
    World
    Ragnarok
    Main Class
    Arcanist Lv 70
    Quote Originally Posted by Zojha View Post
    I reckon for the same reason they expect you to come and start fighting right away in your daily expert roulette, rather than first sitting at the start, walking and emoting around, typing elaborate paragraphs about your character's reactions and thoughts to his/her sorroundings before starting to "walk" further (not run).
    Its not same. Because, in my example we completed objectives of duty asap. So if I apply my example with yours its like -> We completed dung (which is objective) and THEN we spare 80 minutes "walking and emoting around, typing elaborate paragraphs about your character's reactions and thoughts to his/her sorroundings". Which is weird. But somehow people expect its not weird in Diadem.

    So If can SUM things UP:

    Participate on completing objectives in DIADEM is mandatory for everyone.
    After that, you are free to do what you want, you can leave(without penalty) because objective is done, you can gather, you can participate on dino insland farm. Exploring things, dance, whatever. Everything after this point is pure optional.

    Same logic with dungeons
    Participate on completing objectives in dungeon is mandatory for everyone. After that nobody cares if you are staying in dungeon for more, dancing, chatting, looting missed chest, exploring rrest of rooms, clearing rest of trash, etc.


    If you are join any DUTY via DUTYFINDER, your mandatory objectives are written when you enter the instance. Please follow them.
    If you want to create your specific rules for duty, please use party finder and mention that in comment.
    Expecting people to farm 80 minutes mobs on same spot is like expecting people to do Titan EX walk only mode or dungeon only backward movement allowed. Its funny but its your own rule and it has nothing in common with general objective of duty.
    (1)
    Last edited by LunnaRavenheart; 11-24-2015 at 11:01 PM.

  5. #95
    Player
    Zojha's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2015
    Posts
    3,565
    Character
    Lodestone Bait
    World
    Pandaemonium
    Main Class
    Gladiator Lv 1
    Quote Originally Posted by LunnaRavenheart View Post
    Its not same.
    It is. The point is that it's all simply social expectations. You are still going to be completing the dungeon and achieving the objectives if you take it slow like that, there are 90 minutes on the clock after all and just fighting and running through only take about 20-30 of that. Leaves a full hour you can safely waste on fluff.

    People however expect you to be faster just as people expect you to join Dino Island. "They" want a swift run and you are detrimentally affecting that goal by taking it slow. "They" want to get as many 210 pieces as possible and you are detrimentally affecting that goal by not participating in combat. So people expect you to not be a D and work against the goals of the other people. That's really all there is to it. Nothing in the game states you have to, it's all just social expectations.
    (0)

  6. #96
    Player
    LunnaRavenheart's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Posts
    146
    Character
    Lunna Ravenheart
    World
    Ragnarok
    Main Class
    Arcanist Lv 70
    But the point of Diadem is not farm ilvl 210 items, point of that duty is complete objectives. Which i mentioned before, collect 8 bronze chest, botany nodes etc.

    Farming ilvl 210 on dino island is same like you skip that chest in Brayflox HM after 1 boss. Its optional. Social expectation are all subjective.
    Maybe somebody also want that chest in BFHM but we skipped it, maybe somebody also want optional rooms in Haukke Manor. Its all subjective and not part of duty objective. So you may ask people to help you there, but you should not force them to do it.

    However I agree that design of Diadem is bad, good idea - bad design, again SE. But i dont blame players for that. I wrote my expectation of Diadem in other topic here how my design should looks like.
    (1)

  7. #97
    Player
    Zojha's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2015
    Posts
    3,565
    Character
    Lodestone Bait
    World
    Pandaemonium
    Main Class
    Gladiator Lv 1
    Quote Originally Posted by LunnaRavenheart View Post
    But the point of Diadem is not farm ilvl 210 items, point of that duty is complete objectives.
    So as long as you are completing the objectives, it's all good, right? Even if your daily dungeon takes the whole 90 minutes. Because, well...the point is to complete the objectives within the allotted time, not to complete the objectives fast. That's just what some random players want and it's totally optional.

    Good that we reached an understanding there. I hope your party members will consider this in the future.

    That aside, no, the point is not to complete objectives. Objectives are a means, not the end. Do I need to elaborate? I hope not, I'm getting more snarky by the minute.
    (0)

  8. #98
    Player
    Zorlinta's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2014
    Posts
    229
    Character
    Zorlinta Freespirit
    World
    Zodiark
    Main Class
    Fisher Lv 60
    What should be fixed is

    A: reduce the amount of high rank mobs appear.
    B: remove button of need/greed for gathering classes.
    C: increase the goals on missions.

    or
    D: remove option of go Diadem on DF, and allow only FC with good airship goes there.
    The current configuration of Diadem is excelent for FC parties not for PUGs.
    (0)

  9. #99
    Player
    Semirhage's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2015
    Posts
    1,704
    Character
    Nemene Damendar
    World
    Midgardsormr
    Main Class
    Red Mage Lv 90
    This collective community attitude of "must farm Dino Island, must stay there 90 minutes, cannot go anywhere else, cannot split up at all, even if the number of parties there are mutually screwing one another out of chests due to damage requirements and threat table limits, must shriek at gatherers for not coming to my boring farm spot" is exactly why I haven't even managed to drag myself to Diadem to get enough spoils for a Pegasus.

    If I wanted to stand in one spot and farm six mobs for hours and hours out of my day, I'd pick up a freemium Korean grinder MMO.
    (0)

  10. #100
    Player
    odintius's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Posts
    901
    Character
    Odintius Baelsar
    World
    Coeurl
    Main Class
    White Mage Lv 80
    They really do need to add more objectives to the area maybe add gather items that would spawn a two star nm, but make it not to easy to obtain, maybe randomize the objective by adding more of them never have same objectives each time you enter?
    (0)

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