PLD Raise while in combat please!

[Kosmos992k]

As someone who plays pld main, raise would offer nothing to the current end game scene. If you have to cast a long spell to rasie someone in savage you already lost the fight more or less.

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when


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...think outside the raid/end-game scene....

[Malzian]

Not in the UK....
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blinkers_%28horse_tack%29
Not a great start to your post, but hey, we all make mistakes.

Well, I'm in the US and not the UK, and here we call them blinders, but that is semantical difference and completely beside the point.

To answer your second 'point', I've been in many situations in light party where I ould have usefully raised a healer, but obviously could not because of the restriction. I'm not sure how you come up with it being worse since 4-man content is somewhat more forgiving in any case. Either way, I disagree with your analysis and believe that you need to remove your end-game oriented *blinkers*.

In my experience as a tank in all my time playing, the number of times that this would have been useful like this has been so small that the issue of effectively being able to use it makes it a pointless skill to have. Also, I don't have those 'blinkers/blinders/things that cover a horse's eyes' for end game raiding since I don't end game raid. I haven't even set a foot into Alex Savage yet and I'm not really planning on it in the near future, so you're wrong I that assumption there. But hey, we all make mistakes...

[Malevicton]

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...think outside the raid/end-game scene....

about job balance? When it's not the most relevant scene for job balance, probably.

[Kosmos992k]

In my experience as a tank in all my time playing, the number of times that this would have been useful like this has been so small that the issue of effectively being able to use it makes it a pointless skill to have. Also, I don't have those 'blinkers/blinders/things that cover a horse's eyes' for end game raiding since I don't end game raid. I haven't even set a foot into Alex Savage yet and I'm not really planning on it in the near future, so you're wrong I that assumption there.

Well, then I am sorry, when you wrote

If I'm in a fight where I only need to OT, it'd be somewhat alright provided I didn't have to worry about the MT dying when both healers go down.

in a response earlier is surely seemed like you were referring to end-game/raid content which is typically 8-man content with 2 tanks and 2 healers. But, if not, then I apologize. I still think you are wrong. But then I am sure you still think I am wrong, so it's all good.

about job balance? When it's not the most relevant scene for job balance, probably.

Yeah, I understand that, however a PLD being able to use a cross class skill that they already have is hardly unbalancing the game, since it is not a tool any PLD would use lightly thanks to the rather length casting time.

[Fevelle]

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...think outside the raid/end-game scene....

Never. You and I are in the same boat, but this game is never gonna be what we would want. Too much WoW influx of players, too much work to please that player influx, too much development towards content that gives trouble to world's first FCs and too much focus on gearing. Unless they start from scratch, this game is probably doomed to be the same until it closes.

[Kosmos992k]

Never. You and I are in the same boat, but this game is never gonna be what we would want. Too much WoW influx of players, too much work to please that player influx, too much development towards content that gives trouble to world's first FCs and too much focus on gearing. Unless they start from scratch, this game is probably doomed to be the same until it closes.

Indeed.

However, try taking a look at the game from the perspective of a new player. Unless you become very focused and blow through everything to 60, there is a crap ton of stuff to do, and plenty of gearing options. It's a lot more game like and fun if you're not chasing the end-game - IMHO at least.

I do agree with you though. There is too much focus on end-game and raiding with the balance of jobs and skills being solely based on end-game and raiding, along with the gearing being almost exclusively focused on that too. It's kind of interesting if you step off the gear treadmill and watch from the side lines.

[Malzian]

Never. You and I are in the same boat, but this game is never gonna be what we would want. Too much WoW influx of players, too much work to please that player influx, too much development towards content that gives trouble to world's first FCs and too much focus on gearing. Unless they start from scratch, this game is probably doomed to be the same until it closes.

The same until it closes? Heavensward already went a long way towards homogenizing the classes to be much more alike than they were at 2.0 launch. PLD even got Clemency as a healing skill to replace its defunct Cure cross-class, and that has been pushed to the side as well because there's very very few good times to use it. Personally, I came from LotRO and one of the best parts of the system were how distinct the classes were. By making all the classes do all the things you make no class unique and all of them become uninteresting.

[Fevelle]

...

How is making a Paladin what they have been trough all the franchise "homogenizing" it? It would be homogenizing if they could heal on par or better than a WHM. Other than that, Paladins/Knights have always been a sword and shield fighter with White Magic skills and this game being the (sad) exception to it.

Pushing a DPS meta down our throats is much more dangerous to homogenize the jobs than giving healing utilities to PLD.

[Malzian]

How is making a Paladin what they have been trough all the franchise "homogenizing" it? It would be homogenizing if they could heal on par or better than a WHM. Other than that, Paladins/Knights have always been a sword and shield fighter with White Magic skills and this game being the (sad) exception to it.

Pushing a DPS meta down our throats is much more dangerous to homogenize the jobs than giving healing utilities to PLD.

Homogenized in the fact that PLDs now have healing tools and DPS tools that they didn't have before. Tools that, while they may not be 'on par' with WHM, were meant to pull some (not all) of the healing burden off of healers. A PLD should never be a replacement for a WHM or SCH. They are tanks, WAR are tanks... Even if they seem more like DPS at the moment. Pushing too much of another class/role's ability onto another class muddles that role, it doesn't give it a clear, distinct purpose so you know what to expect and what is expected of you in a fight, and honestly that makes it -harder- on a new player, especially when you go from 2.x content to 3.x content and you're suddenly expected to do things outside of your already selected role. Do I believe in making players stretch out of their comfort zone? Yes, as a teacher I encourage people to do it all the time. But I don't sit someone down in a Math class and start expecting them to quote Macbeth to me.

[SonKevin]

That's EXACTLY what we don't want. Paladin always had acess to useful WHM spells in FF games, this one being the exception. I don't see how it would make it "the same as other classes". Alas, PLD is already a freaking generic tank prototype as is.

You sound mad. Stop being mad. While my statement was over the top, I do agree that adding Holy to PLD would make sense, I would disagree that adding battle raise to a PLD makes sense. As far as I can find, but I haven't looked everywhere, the only FF game that gives PLD raise is FFXI. Cecil doesn't have it. None of the tactics games have it. While having a light healing ability and holy make sense, raise still does not.