Thread: 3.1 PLD Changes

Originally Posted by Brian_

This is a really extreme and shallow approach to the issue. It lacks so much nuance it might as well be incorrect.

Their view on tanking classes isn't unrealistic. You could make the argument that encounters are just not tuned or designed correctly. When they say they're looking to change the encounters rather than change the classes, while I don't trust that they'll get the tuning right based on their history, it's an understandable way to approach the issue.

A lot of people spout out the idea that the best mitigation is more DPS. Since you kill something faster, you take less damage. That is a simplification of the truth and it's so simplified it might as well be false.

Here is the actual reality of what raiders deal with and why it's a nuanced issue --

There is no such thing as too much tank survivability out of context. It's always good for a tank to have more eHP.

The issue is understanding things in context.

Some MMOs have consistent eHP checks through higher tank damage intake and healer MP strain. If there is a constant stream of significant damage or unpredictable burst, then having high persistent eHP matters more. If you have higher eHP, it allows healers to be more MP efficient when healing you since less of their healing will be potential over healing.

The thing is FFXIV is the complete opposite of that. General tank damage intake is very forgiving and there isn't much unpredictable burst. The base eHP benchmark is low and we're given a lot of essentially over-powered eHP boosters to push ourselves to safety range for the predictable burst. Due to the nature of damage intake, healers have a much easier time being proactive rather than reactionary with their heals and can better plan out overall MP usage. Healers also have a lot of MP recovery mechanics as well as a raid battery.

Add that to a raid design mentality which forces you to optimize for DPS, and you get the current situation where tanks are dropping eHP they don't need to survive in order to clear DPS checks.

Normally, having more eHP allows for a larger buffer and margin of error. Because of encounter tuning in FFXIV, the added DPS does so more efficiently because of the design of mechanics. Take A3S for example -- Digi passing went wrong and someone who shouldn't have damage down has it? Someone accidently attacked the wrong hand for too long during equal concentration? Accidentally had someone die to tether AoE? RNG screwed you and linked your DPS in ferro-fluid every time for add phase? Mistimed a stun on a piston? Heavy effects constantly missing? Messed up a ferro-fluid and now have 2 people with atrophy? Accidentally had the limb clip through a puddle? Something went wrong and you can't rely on LB to either kill limb or nuke the boss? Normally, these would all likely wipe your party due to the drop off in DPS contribution. But, with enough raid DPS, they are recoverable mistakes.

On the flip side, there aren't that many mistakes that will punish a tank for not having enough persistent eHP. Having more eHP doesn't bail you out of many situations, either.

The balance between the two tanking archetypes exists within the tuning and design of the encounter. Currently, there is an imbalance in how impactful the two elements are on overall raid margins. You need to tune it properly so that the advantages of being tankier or having more utility are actually comparable to having more raid DPS.

Whether or not PLD is tankier or offers more utility is another issue entirely. But, to say the two archetypes cannot co-exist is wrong.

Having vitality lessons your chance of failure. (Makes you less likely to get one-shot.)
Having damage increases your overall sustain. (Makes the fight shorter.)

If Paladins actually had some cool utility, as well as Dark Knights and both were not pigeon-holed in "Magic" and "Physical" tanks, then this issue would all fix itself.

Example, what if paladin skills were based around warding damage off himself. Dark Knight skills were based around lifetaps?

Now you have 3 different tanks.
Life-tap Tank.
Preventive Damage Tank.
Raw DR Tank.

I think something does need changed a bit.