Dragoon Punished at lvl 58 - What needs to be done with Wheeling Thrust

[Darus]

Edit - Too many people couldn't read the whole thing, orthe bold, italicized, underlined summaries, so I'm remaking this from the ground up and using less negative words or in less negative ways.


Wheeling thurst - This is a twin positional move to lvl 56 Fang and Claw that adds in a degree of randomization to the skill. When you do a combo, you randomly proc one or the other, which requires to use the right skill at the right location to get full damage (100 potency vs 290).

Problem - At level 58, Dragoons received Wheeling Thrust. This move only adds difficulty to lvl 56 skill, Fang and Claw, making it feel like you aren't getting rewarded at 58, but punished.

Solution - Stack Wheeling Thrust with Fang and Claw as a reward for lvl 56. It is the counter balance to add in more skill needed for Fang and Claw, and being twin moves, do not need to be separate job rewards.

As you can see, as it stands, it feels like you aren't being reward for all your hard work in getting to 58, but punished. Together, as a whole, Fang and Claw and Wheeling Thrust feels incredibly fun and do a good deal of extra DPS in a combo. Separated, receiving Wheeling Thrust as it's own level reward adds a tiny bit of difficulty and makes us feel like we were cheated out of the reward and instead given something negative.

Having the two together, as opposed to one removes the ability to plan ahead and causes a loss of DPS as opposed to JUST having Fang and Claw. This means we're going down in potential DPS when we hit 58 and do the job quest. A downgrade is a terrible reward to have, even if it makes the class more fun, knowing that fun is reducing effectiveness leaves a sour taste in your mouth. So the skills need either be combined into the same job reward or given separate useful effects to make it worth while having to randomly go beside or behind a massive boss.

[Dethevn]

There should be no skills we take in the game that no one would want. This is the issue, it's a PUNISHMENT.

The BRDs here would like to have a word.. But seriously, "more choice" is the least of all problems plaguing some of the jobs right now.

Not to mention DRG is top DPS right now.

[DSaint]

Sometimes I think SE just like to troll Dragoons for lulz.

Before DRG positional buff: "Oh, missed a positional? Good luck next time, and stop QQ."

DRG positional buff: "Okay, don't cry. No one will call you loldrg again."

3.0, few months later: " Nah!! Just kidding! Back to positional punishment! lolololol"

[Dervy]

I have absolutely no problems with Wheeling Thrust and Fang & Claw. I don't see what the fuss is. Do I miss positionals? Yeah, sometimes I do when the boss is spin happy. But you have more than enough time to think where you need to position yourself next. I can even position myself and accurately hit both Wheeling Thrust and Fang & Claw on mobs with nano-meeter hitboxes. If you know how AOEs work, you can run into AOE's, hit positionals and run out again, without getting hit, maxing out your positionals. Learn how the animations work and learn to plan two steps ahead. Dragoon isn't an easy job to play no-more.

It's all practice.

Do I feel like it's a wasted a ability and they could of some something more imaginative with it? Yes. Is it punishment? Absolutely not. Practice on a dummy until you've perfected it.

[SpecialKK]

Do I feel like it's a wasted a ability and they could of some something more imaginative with it? Yes. Is it punishment? Absolutely not. Practice on a dummy until you've perfected it.

I don't know that I would call it "punishment". It is, however, completely pointless. Other than to make the job more difficult for the player, that is.

Not only does it add a positional that gives a hefty penalty if missed, but it takes away one button mapping (especially for the already limited gamepad control scheme) while adding nothing that the other skill doesn't already provide.

Put it this way, if DRGs are told that we get a pretty much worthless skill (such as Feint) at lvl 58 as opposed to a duplicate of what we get at 56 that further complicates our job...I would bet most would take the crappy skill and never look back.

[warren-ragnarok]

It's all practice.

i can see all the loldrg's saying "sh**, now i have to get good"

all the good drgs must be saying to them "get good or go brd"

[Havenchild]

After having made it to 56 on DRG, I can see both the skill ceiling increase and understand it doesn't need to be easy but I disagree with the un-needed conplexity. All the RNG and level 58 skill serves is to potentially lower your DPS from a missed positional. That in itself seems pretty damn pointless outside distinguishing those from the rest who can perfectly execute it.

I think the more correct way they could have added complexity to it but reduce the RNG was simply to give Full Thrust a flank positional which then combos into Wheeling Thrust. Chaos Thrust would then combo into Fang and Claw thus you would have a rear and flank setting on each combo string that would force movement as well. Complexity without RNG.

[HeavensSword]

I'd recommend doing what Dervy suggested in the Dragoon DPS thread, by making the 2 4th combo skill icons large to make it more apparent which is active.

Also, I wouldn't want a DoT tied to a skill that procs randomly. If you argue that the alternative skill giving a buff would be equivalent DPS to the DoT, then you may as well just make the skills the same again. Only other alternative is to remove the randomness and separate the skills; only use one of the skills to extend BotD as a 4th combo skill and change the second to something completely unrelated to the BotD mechanic.

[kyrios91]

I'd recommend doing what Dervy suggested in the Dragoon DPS thread, by making the 2 4th combo skill icons large to make it more apparent which is active.

I did something similar to this that I put WT, FnC, and GK on the middle of my hotbars and assigned WT to M1 and FnC to M2 so I can spam click whatever's active because you won't 'accidentally' click the other skill because it won't be available.

Though it'll be nice if let's say WT procs after FT / CT and FnC procs after the other combo, once I've played around dungeons / ex primals with the new rotation I'm now used to it. With the power of our DPS now you won't lose DPS by taking 0.5 seconds to move to the right position just in-case WT procs when you're on the flank and same goes for FnC.

[ErzaScarlet77]

so i finally got wheeling thrust a couple days ago and ive had zero problem with it.
it kinda plays a bit like mnk with moving to side/flank. i do think the lvl 56 skill needs damage boost tho. even with correct positionals, it still does crap damage