Bad/casual players with worse attitudes than the good "elitist" players

[Critical-Limit]

Stuff

Not saying anyone uses it or not. But people who do use it, crunch numbers and find a job can put out 1,300 dPS. How can you possibly know where you stand as a dPS if you have no clue what numbers you put out? Don't place yourself in "average" or above "average" if you don't have the tools to judge yourself.

Clearing content means little as a dPS unless you're clearing savage. My DPS on my monk is good enough I can carry atleast 1-2 other dPS through any content that isn't savage. So for all you know you're getting carried occasionally. You have no idea.

If you are doing really good chances are you got advice from people which can be sourced to the root that came from parsing. People who parse know the real numbers tell people the best rotation they found then that gets passed around. So if you are following best rotation, chances are parsing helped you without you knowing it.

[KingOfAbyss]

Not saying anyone uses it or not. But people who do use it, crunch numbers and find a job can put out 1,300 dPS. How can you possibly know where you stand as a dPS if you have no clue what numbers you put out? Don't place yourself in "average" or above "average" if you don't have the tools to judge yourself.

Clearing content means little as a dPS unless you're clearing savage. My DPS on my monk is good enough I can carry atleast 1-2 other dPS through any content that isn't savage. So for all you know you're getting carried occasionally. You have no idea.

If you are doing really good chances are you got advice from people which can be sourced to the root that came from parsing. People who parse know the real numbers tell people the best rotation they found then that gets passed around. So if you are following best rotation, chances are parsing helped you without you knowing it.

1300 DPS? What's that? I've been into games and Critical Hit for 12000, does that count?

FYI, there's any type of players in every game.

Those who want to get into Savage mode (end game, niche part of it) Will be required to perform at their best to clear.

I've been with raids that no one was using any parsers, and it took one month to clear, but we did it. We learned the mechanics, one step at a time.

DPS were DPSing and didn't die, Tanks were Tanking and doing some DPS, and Healers were Healing and doing some DPS.

We had a blast, lots of fun!

If the end game comes into a point were you need to be top notch else you are kicked, don't wonder why you have less people playing it, for it seems a majority of friend players on my server don't even touch that part.

So SE made this supposedly for those that want a bigger challenge.

I'm fine with that.

Don't DF it if you expect to have everyone just like you and you don't want to 'carry' others from time to time. PF is your friend then, or your static.

If you DF anything in this game, you ask for the real challenge: to try to make it with people that think they are the best, and don't communicate except when things goes sour and.. they bash others.

And I don't need a parser to think of myself where I stand, thank you. Best rotation and or became really good: I read my skills like anyone else should and try to use them when I think it fits best. Saved some wipes at 3% when I was under 1000 HP and pop a HG on PLD, for instance. I could have missed it with the lag or anything, but it worked. These are the best times.

There are some like me that will play the game that way, and others that will play your way.

If SE makes it mandatory, then: some will leave, others will adapt.

Until then, see you in DF! ^^

[Seryl199]

It's getting pretty tiring to see so many posts such as this one reinforce the myth that casual players are crappy and that crappy players are casual.

I understand the OP's point - some horrible players give more attitude than players that play well.

What, then, is the reason for the OP to say in his title "bad/casual"?

It's human nature to relate to one group or another. It's this forum's nature to boil that down to casual/elite and good/bad. It's the nature of the ignorant to group casual and bad together.

The vast majority of casual players, while they may not have BIS gear, are more than competent at their jobs and at dungeon mechanics. Time for the "good" players in this forum to park their egos.

Casual and elitist are such blanket terms that they don't hold any meaningful definition. Just as its human nature to relate to a group, so is it human nature to try and categorize things in a way that is easy to comprehend and communicate about. When every player starts defining their own casuals and elitists, and even self proclaim themselves as hardcore elitist, casual midcore, and what have you, the definition muddies more.

The OP is more about attitudes than demographics. There's not much you can do about bads beyond offer advice, and that's at the player's discretion. The bad player will graciously accept the advice and try it, ignore it, or, the outcome that brings about discussions like this, become confrontational and refuse any criticism. There's not much else we can do as players.

Until content holds players accountable to the point that they cannot be carried, these players have no incentive to improve. They can try again and again until they get carried through an instance, and any time they don't pass, it's another player's fault for not pulling their weight, any criticism aimed their way is summarily deflected and thrown back in the face of experienced players. Why do these players have a bad attitude about being bad? Nothing in the game has enforced a standard that makes them consider their stance.

[Priya]

Lack of addons.

Let's put in a parser and an EnsidiaFails addon and see if the jerky super bads continue being jerky.









Oh wait, addons cause harassment and stuff.

[Critical-Limit]

stuff

I don't know if you're talking in general or making assumptions about me. But I don't care if I carry, I like to help people. I love helping people, in fact I get told to shut up and mind my own business because I will offer advice when I'm not asked to too much possibly.

I used me being able to clear content with multiple DPS dead as a example that just because you don't die and your team clears it, doesn't mean you're not getting carried a bit because the person I quoted claimed to know where he stands skill wise, but how can he possibly know w/o someone telling him his numbers or he cleared AS3/4. And even if someone did test his numbers and we found he was accurate. His dislike for parse is probably still unfounded because if he accepts advice he more than likely got it from someone who used parse to find the best rotation.

[SchalaZeal]

Because new gamers are spoiled and haven't lived through what we have. Remember lugging around your pc to a friend's house just so you can play in multiplayer LAN games like Age of Empires or Counter Strike together? or playing fighting games with your buddies on the couch nudging shoulders to try and distract them? I lived through these days and its what shaped me as a gamer today.

I was born in early 80s and started playing at 3. Never carried a PC around to play LAN (at best I played at school, where they had one, but multiplayer RTS was never my favorite), and I played fighting games when I was 10, because I was bored. Never mastered a single character, or cared about memorizing their 15 combos each that require pinpoint precision. I played solo turn-based RPGs, platforming, adventure games. Had the most fun alone, at my pace.

[rappa]

I think most bads are "hardcore" only because they have the ability to sit on their computers all day when other people have RL commitments. I have met a lot better and nicer players who are casual because they always do their best. The "hardcore" crowd is the toxic community.

Just because some people have Savage gear doesn't mean they've pulled their weight, the same with Final Coils, so many bads got carried through or paid their way through.

Everyone, don't lump people together into groups. If you're being a dick to people you are just a dick .

The only word i could say is "Sorry".

Sorry for spent 20 hours each week during one month and a half to clear the content and play 2 hours each week after that.
Sorry for not helping you into Bismark - Ravana clear with ours 210 weapons.
Sorry for being a competitive player who put their weight into encounters before others players do and be rewarded.


The next time, i will switch my savage gear into law gear to don't harras you.

[Aomine1992]

Simple...

Bad players have to have someone to blame and their casual friends always agree cause to them they are playing at the top level...

[Azazua_azura]

-reads thread-

I just see this thread as the WoW crowd not understanding how to play due to lack of leagal addons. Wither the "bad" players who got used to addons telling them exactly what to do, to those who need a parser to play. -shrug- I've been gaming since before the internet, we never needed these things. I think its those who treat this game like a job are whats really wrong here. Are people "bad" because an inaccurate program told them so? Having a high dps DOES NOT mean you are a good player. In ff11 and wow i've seen so called high dps (according to what parser told them) but they were the ones to cause wipes because they throttled to hard.

I'm kinda getting tired of the dps/parser crowd to be frank, I can tell who they are simple by their playstyle. They the type to precast before pulls w/o a tank marking or picking a target to pull. Which 9 times out10, its the mob NOT pulled and they get hate and die, then blame tank for not getting hate. They are the Ranged and melee dps who attack on pull with out giving the tank to place the mobs in a optimal position or place, getting hate and dying then blaming the tank for not getting hate. And lastly they are the healers who rely on either their fairies, regen and heal tanks at the absolute last second, to get the most out of their dps, the type who outside of whm place cross cleric stance first instead of protect.


Also, maybe you should look at what you guys posted, you guys are coming off rude if not snarky. There is more to this game, and learning then having a high dps. And alot of pro-parser people just don't get it. Skill comes with time, and practice. You don't need a parser for that, players/gamers have been doing this well befor the internet became mainstream.

There are a ton of factors that come with being a good player.

1) Having a good attitude- being open minded of those around you, take consideration of your group make up, their gear, adjust accordingly based on those and player skill. Ask/offer advice on jobs you play, offer tips about the dungeon/boss fight. Never toss advice and ram it down peoples throats.

2) Pactice your job and its roll- party up with players who leveled the class/roll enter dungeons undersized and min ilvl and simply play your role, stoping for tips and advice on how to better yourself. (good up untill hw content).

3) practice content- form a group of friends who know the dungeon and run it several times, if ARR run it under undersized and min livl. ask for tips on how to do each boss encounter, like when to dodge to get the most out of your cooldowns, or skills.


Those are basic stuff you can do to become a better player, it also helps oif the community would help teach newer players or being more patient with them. Let players make mistakes to learn, you learn nothing by constently winning. Guides and videons only go so far, a parser can only state how much dmg your outputting over the course of a fight.


And be aware that other factors can come into play such as a persons net getting a lag spike, or is laggy due to weather, or other reasons. Which can factor in their dps, and getting hit by stuff.

[Ilitsa]

I think part of the reason is that ps4 is a pretty big part of this games playerbase and majority of them have absolutely NO clue how much dps they actually do.

They think their hot shit when in reality they are doing less than that 'meh' geared paladin in shield oath. So they keep doing what their doing, thinking it's all good.

This is only part of it. There are tons of different reasons for this happening.

Basically I'll leave it at "bads will be bad"

not all of us are like that, I'm on ps4, and every 5-10 ilvl increase I get I sit with one of my friends and figure out what my dps is through either target dummy practice or averaging out of 3 or 4 dungeons, if I don't have even a slight increase I rethink how I'm doing stuff and try to squeeze out as much as I can, i'm far from perfect, but I do. PC players are just as guilty for the attitude as the console players are. it boils down to the fact that SE forbids us from doing anything to dissuade this attitude, and does nothing themselves to do so. There needs to be a website or a list somewhere where people with horrid, shitty attitudes are listed down, so us nicer, more decent players can reference and avoid playing with these people.